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New Monster Oil Formula that Is Vegetable Based

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  • davewerden
    Administrator
    • Nov 2005
    • 11142

    New Monster Oil Formula that Is Vegetable Based

    I've tried it. I like it. I'll be using this going forward (both the valve oil and the slide grease). Here is my review:

    https://www.dwerden.com/forum/entry....table-Products

    Monster Eco Valve Oil and Slide Grease
    Last edited by davewerden; 02-24-2024, 07:37 PM.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium
  • ghmerrill
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2011
    • 2387

    #2
    I'm curious as to exactly what oil(s) they use in this (and what other ingredients it may have). But I can't find a data sheet on it anywhere. I've experimented with a number of "non-petroleum" (or more often supposedly non-petroleum) oils in several different circumstances -- some not pertaining to musical instruments. There are a bunch of different vegetable and nut oils that can be used as lubricants, and they can behave quite differently from one another. For certain applications I can use olive oil, but Jojoba oil is also very popular (though more expensive).

    A lot of trombonists now use one or another silicone gel or silicone oil for their hand slides, but various other things are added to it in order to enhance its properties. Most people don't realize that such lubricants (such as Yamaha slide lubricant) may contain ethylene glycol (that's right: anti-freeze! ) and other "chemicals." On the other hand, most people don't realize that ethylene glycol is a very common ingredient in skin products. (In addition to being "anti-freeze" and a known poison in certain concentrations, ethylene glycol is a surfactant. A lot of cosmetics contain it. I think it's definitely one of the things that makes the Yamaha slide slime work so well.)

    I don't have an axe to grind here, one way or the other. But I'm always curious to see exactly what's in a product I'm using beyond what the marketing people want me to know. Is there any information in this case? I can't seem to find any.

    But in any event, I see I now have yet another valve oil to try.
    Last edited by ghmerrill; 02-24-2024, 08:51 PM.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

    Comment

    • highpitch
      Senior Member
      • Mar 2006
      • 1034

      #3
      My order is on the way. Will inform if it shapes up better than Hetmans in my New Standard.

      DG

      Comment

      • John Morgan
        Moderator
        • Apr 2014
        • 1885

        #4
        I ordered also. I used Monster Oil in the past and liked it. Not sure why I didn't stick with it. But I am always on the lookout for something that works better than what I have, currently Blue Juice. I like Blue Juice, but it doesn't last as long as I would like. We'll see how this new Monster Oil is. I ordered the kit with the valve oil, slide oil and grease. Having a trigger, I use grease along with something else, usually valve oil. I will try this grease and slide oil for my trigger.
        John Morgan
        The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
        Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium,
        1973 F. E. Olds & Son Studio Model T-31 Baritone
        Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
        Year Round Except Summer:
        Kingdom of the Sun (KOS) Concert Band, Ocala, FL (Euphonium)
        KOS Brass Quintet (Trombone, Euphonium)
        Summer Only:
        Rapid City Municipal Band, Rapid City, SD (Euphonium)
        Rapid City New Horizons Band (Euphonium)

        Comment

        • davewerden
          Administrator
          • Nov 2005
          • 11142

          #5
          Schmitt told me that the vegetable base is corn. That's the only extra data I have.
          Dave Werden (ASCAP)
          Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
          Adams Artist (Adams E3)
          Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
          YouTube: dwerden
          Facebook: davewerden
          Twitter: davewerden
          Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

          Comment

          • highpitch
            Senior Member
            • Mar 2006
            • 1034

            #6
            Schmitt told me that the vegetable base is corn.

            Mazola Monster!

            Comment

            • ghmerrill
              Senior Member
              • Dec 2011
              • 2387

              #7
              That's really old school as far as vegetable oils go. I was expecting something more "boutique-y". But of course the choice depends on the particular application and how it's refined (plus any additives). And corn oil is seriously economical. For my own applications, I've generally been concerned with flashpoint or combustion temperature -- not usually a concern with euphoniums unless you're playing REALLY fast passages.
              Gary Merrill
              Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
              Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
              Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
              1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
              Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
              1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

              Comment

              • Brass is Class
                Member
                • Jul 2023
                • 45

                #8
                Being a tightwad, cheapskate, skin flint, miser, or just plain frugal, I usually don’t switch valve/slide lubricants unless I’m not happy with something and only after I’m down to the last few drops. Former Al Cass user, switched to Blue Juice several years ago and it was my one lube for valves (trumpet, euph, French horn rotors, and tuba) and for my trombone. Would occasionally add a drop or 2 of Mobil1 to trombone slides for longer lasting slide smooth action. (5W-30 in case anybody is wondering) Still happy with Blue for all my valves, finally broke down and tried the Yamaha snot for trombone. Even after cleaning the slides I wasn’t impressed first couple of outings, actually got much worse action for about 2 weeks. Ready to give it to my tuba buddy that has a trombone playing son and brother, but it finally really smoothed out much to my surprise, and now lasts several weeks, without motor oil. Guess lubricants can leave behind residues even with multiple cleanings that as the old report card saying goes “Doesn’t play well with others”. Curious to see long term reports of how Monster Oil continues to perform, especially in terms of residue, and in temperature variations.

                Comment

                • davewerden
                  Administrator
                  • Nov 2005
                  • 11142

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Brass is Class View Post
                  ... switched to Blue Juice several years ago and it was my one lube for valves...
                  I think Blue Juice works very well. Many people don't care for the smell of that one or petroleum oils in general, but it never bothered me much.

                  Originally posted by Brass is Class View Post
                  Curious to see long term reports of how Monster Oil continues to perform, especially in terms of residue, and in temperature variations.
                  Me, too! I'll report back if I see anything unusual, of course. Just a note: I do not play in freezing temps, so I won't be able to assess that facet of performance.
                  Dave Werden (ASCAP)
                  Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
                  Adams Artist (Adams E3)
                  Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
                  YouTube: dwerden
                  Facebook: davewerden
                  Twitter: davewerden
                  Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

                  Comment

                  • ghmerrill
                    Senior Member
                    • Dec 2011
                    • 2387

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Brass is Class View Post
                    ... finally broke down and tried the Yamaha snot for trombone. Even after cleaning the slides I wasn’t impressed first couple of outings, actually got much worse action for about 2 weeks. Ready to give it to my tuba buddy that has a trombone playing son and brother, but it finally really smoothed out much to my surprise, ...
                    I have seen other reports of that. I'd tried several years ago and didn't like it (maybe mostly because of the old applicator they had on the bottles), but everyone was raving about it so much that I gave it another chance, and now I don't think of using anything else.

                    Originally posted by Brass is Class View Post
                    and now lasts several weeks, without motor oil.
                    I'm guessing that was a design goal.
                    Gary Merrill
                    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
                    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
                    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
                    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
                    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
                    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

                    Comment

                    • Brass is Class
                      Member
                      • Jul 2023
                      • 45

                      #11
                      As far as the smell of Blue Juice, I never really noticed it. Even after 25+ years of working in a pulp and paper mill I always had a sensitive smeller. COVID did seem to diminish it a little, but I’m still at least average in smell detection. Selmer tuning slide grease is noticeable to me for whatever that’s worth, but it’s always worked for me and once slides are in place I lose the odor. But then again I'm one of those that enjoy the smell of diesel exhaust.

                      Comment

                      • ghmerrill
                        Senior Member
                        • Dec 2011
                        • 2387

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Brass is Class View Post
                        As far as the smell of Blue Juice, I never really noticed it. ... I’m still at least average in smell detection.
                        But that's not how smell works. There is no "average" in smell detection. It's not that everyone smells the same things and it's just a matter of degree. It's that some people smell things that other people just don't smell. Or smell "the same thing" in very different ways. Blue Juice is one of those things. I can't stand it (although I've seen some references recently that indicate they've addressed that problem), but other people are fine with it or don't detect any particular smell at all.

                        I'm perfectly fine with with Ballistol. My wife, on the other hand, is so distressed by it that she won't have it used in the house, and any rags or paper towels I use with it must be relegated to my garage waste can.

                        When you say "I never really noticed it," this is almost certainly true in the fully literal sense: you literally can't smell some of the "odors" it emits -- which is quite different from smelling them and either ignoring them or finding them tolerable or attractive.
                        Gary Merrill
                        Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
                        Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
                        Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
                        1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
                        Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
                        1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

                        Comment

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