Yamaha YEP-202M Marching Euphonium

[Arnbone Euph]

About to add this to my instrument family. Also about to join a 50-year-since-its-founding community marching band. I will NOT be trying to use my very heavy Sterling Virtuoso as a marching euphonium (my back wouldn't allow it). So wondering how many if any of you have had experience with marching euphoniums. Back when I was last in a marching band (high school in the 60s), I don't recall ever seeing or hearing of such a thing. We just utilized our concert baritones (that's what we called them then; they were actually euphoniums). I love my Yamaha bass trombone, so figured I'd do OK by going with a Yamaha marching euphonium.

Thoughts?

--Arnie

[davewerden]

Good move (not using the Virtuoso for marching!). The side-valve design has many disadvantages for marching, and it would be a shame to mess up that instrument.

The newer invention of marching euphoniums would be a good way to point forward in a parade, but they also put a strain on your shoulders and back.

In the Coast Guard Band we used King Cleveland small euphoniums with 3 valves. They are light and well balanced for carrying and playing. Sound is decent. We used upright bells for some reason, but if I had it to do over I'd look for a bell front version. The better quality King 3-valve would also be OK, but a little heavier. If can find a front-valve bell-front American euphonium, most brands would be fine (Conn, King, Olds, Holton).

The marching euphoniums ARE fun to play around with, though!

[davewerden]

Something like this. It is the cheaper version without as much of the fancy trim (and that saves weight!):

https://www.ebay.com/itm/304950146113

It has a few dents already, so there is less heartache when the inevitable collisions happen!

[RickF]

I agree, a good move 'not' to march with a standard euphonium. When I marched in H.S. back in the 60s we also used the King Cleveland 3 valve horns but with bent bell. Not too heavy and sounded okay. When I marched in "USAF Blue Knights Drum and Bugle Corps" we used one valve and one rotor key of 'G' bugles. They were easy to march with but pretty bright sounding in key of 'G'. (image here). Glad they no longer use these.

The Yamaha 202 sounds like a good choice to me.

[Fujiifilm]

Having used a marching euphonium in drum corps (though not the Yamaha 202M, the corps I marched with used Jupiter and later King) as well as a marching baritone back in high school, I'm not sure I would recommend a euph for what you're looking to do. While not as heavy as a compensating euphonium, the bulk of the weight of the instrument is rather far out in front of you (like a giant trumpet) and can put strain on your shoulders/upper back and arms as Dave mentioned already.

An alternative that can be around the same price point (or even a bit cheaper, depending on condition) is the Yamaha YBH-301M marching baritone. It takes a large shank mouthpiece like the euphonium and has the same bore size, but is more compact and lighter weight, while still able to produce a quality sound. The valve block is also a bit closer to you, which can make it easier to hold up at playing position for longer periods of time.


Yamaha specs page:
YBH-301M

YEP-202M

Comparison photos sourced from Facebook pages for Santa Clara Vanguard and Bluecoats, respectively:
Baritone

Euphonium:

[UglyGrayDuck]

I will also second the idea that a marching euph/baritone have more strain on your back/shoulders than one might think. I marched these for four years in high school. By junior year, it wasn't so bad, but still not particularly comfortable. We had little competitions within the section called "circle of death" where we would stand in a circle and just hold the horn up for as long as possible. Last one to drop wins!

[iMav]

I marched with a “baritone bugle” in the USAF for a while (two valve). Lighter than what is being talked about here…and also I was young, so no big deal.

I’m in my 50s now and stick with trombone if I do any marching.

[dsurkin]

I marched a couple of times using my Mack Brass euphonium. I used a harness to support the weight. I found it restricted my view of section mates to my side and I was frequently getting out of line. My teacher and section mate, Rob Stattel, used a British baritone for one of the gigs, which was lighter than his usual Willson or his backup Besson.

[Arnbone Euph]

I was section leader for Baritone Bugles (one valve) all during Navy Boot camp in San Diego at age 17. I don't recall the bugle feeling as though it weighed anything at all. But I think after playing my Sterling, any marching euphonium is going to feel light in comparison. The marching band I'll be joining does fairly short parade marching and a lot of playing in stationary mode. Not too concerned with weight issues, but I have to say this thread has garnered some very interesting testimony. (The things we put our bodies through to pursue our musical passions lol).

Thanks for all the responses.

[tokuno]

I own and prefer a bell-front (removable bell - very handy) Olds Ambassador 3-valve old-style "baritone".
Its advantages:
- Plays much better than my Yamaha marching baritone (esp. high range), with shorter, quicker valve throws
- Superior ergonomics (weight held close to my body instead of cantilevered out). In fact, today's my birthday, and as my lower back enters its 6th decade, I pay dearly for extending weight beyond my core; the bill-come-due for years of poor posture and sports/activity abuse.
- Varied grip/holding options to reduce hand/wrist strain & overall weariness. I really appreciate this on longer sets & gigs.
- No lyre required. Cradling the horn allows off-hand music hold with infinitely variable adjustment (great for my aging eyes)
BUT
My son joined me in a rock/pep-band group (that favors marching horn form factor), so I gave him my marching baritone, and I'm (coincidentally today) purchasing a replacement.
After attending 4 children's worth of marching events, I believe that bell-front euphs don't carry well, and the aural opportunity cost is high compared to marching baritones, or, better, more trombones (maybe it's the lower resistance? But even the bigger-belled trombones seemed to out-carry the baritones & esp. euphs during field shows).
Also, marching euphs carry more weight further from my core than baritones (cantilever force multiplier - ouch), so marching baritone is my choice.

If what mattered to my group was musical quality, the Olds Ambassador would be a no-brainer. As it is, I'm intending to sell it. The valves are in good shape as are the body/lacquer, so I'm expecting $400 or more. One can probably find less of a looker for a lower price on eBay. I.e. I think these old-style horns are relatively cheap compared to the in-demand marching style horns.

[tokuno]

An alternative that can be around the same price point (or even a bit cheaper, depending on condition) is the Yamaha YBH-301M marching baritone. It takes a large shank mouthpiece like the euphonium and has the same bore size, but is more compact and lighter weight, while still able to produce a quality sound. The valve block is also a bit closer to you, which can make it easier to hold up at playing position for longer periods of time.


Yamaha specs page:
YBH-301M

YEP-202M

Comparison photos sourced from Facebook pages for Santa Clara Vanguard and Bluecoats, respectively:
Baritone
[ATTACH=CONFIG]10513[/ATTACH]
Euphonium:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]10514[/ATTACH]

I looked it up:
Yamaha baritone 301M: 5.5 lbs
Yamaha euphonium 202M: 7.3 lbs

I marvel at the weight those bass drum lines carry, and wonder if that strengthens their lower backs, or if they're gonna pay the piper in a few decades.

[aroberts781]

I have enjoyed following this thread. When I was last in high school and college marching bands from 2000 through 2008 I always played that Yamaha marching baritone (YBH-301M) and have very fond memories of playing it in various shows and parades. I always thought they had a decent sound. I have mentioned on the forum that if money/space/practicality/logic were no object I would like to add an American bell-front euphonium to my lineup, and every time the YBH-301M gets mentioned I have the same feeling of wanting to pick one up some day to have lying around.

To Arnie, thanks for kickstarting this conversation and good luck with your purchase!

[Arnbone Euph]

You're welcome. Kind of interesting that we decades-long humans still hearken back to those marching band or corps days and look for opportunities to rekindle the joy of that form of our music history. So many varied perspectives on this. I remember playing bell front CONNs for much of my junior-high and high-school and how novel it felt to handle my first Besson upright. I made second chair all region band and state in my junior year with a Besson. But in the Navy, getting to play a baritone bugle was another whole new experience that had its own rewards. And in Navy A school learning to be a morse code intercept operator, we formed a band to represnt our Pensacola base for Mardi Gras in N.O. and I had the memorable experience of marching with a forward bell baritone of some kind for 13 parade miles and playing Anchors Aweight probably about a hundred times.

[Arnbone Euph]

Not surprisingly I came across a John Packer verions of a marching euphonium, the JP2053. Here is a brief sound sample by a British fellow (who gets a pretty darn good sound out of it).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eu7IGagAN10

[tokuno]

Thomann MBH-303s (Yama-clone) marching baritone is scheduled to arrive on Tuesday.
UPS assessed modest brokerage & government import charges.
My employer provides each of us with an annual $500 "worklife balance wellness fund" whose remaining balance I applied to this purchase, so even if it's only a marginal player, it's cheaper, in better shape, and lower risk than what I was seeing on the used market. Best I can tell by the pictures, the Yamaha, JP, and Thomann look functionally identical (only difference I discern is the valve buttons).
Looking forward to seeing how it play-compares to the authentic Yamaha.