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Thread: FS: Salvation Army Triumphonic Compensating Baritone Horn - Silver

  1. #1

    FS: Salvation Army Triumphonic Compensating Baritone Horn - Silver

    Here is a nice baritone horn, I think! It has a 3-valve compensating system and is quite pretty. This is a smaller bore than my own baritone and smaller bell as well so it should easily give the clear distinction from a euphonium's sound. Seller says the compression is very good, and the photos say that the general condition is also very good. The price is a very reasonable $1,050, which seems like a good price for this particular instrument.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/275559578784

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    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC4)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  2. This horn (#31131) dates from 1963. The SA had to pay a license fee for every compensating Triumphonic baritone and the Super Triumphonic euphonium to Boosey&Hawkes/Besson for the compensating design. The generally inferior quality of the SA horns combined with the unprofitability of manufacturing a limited supply of instruments that they had to pay license fees on helped lead of the demise of instrument manufacturing by the SA in February of 1972.

    I previously owned #31794, a 1964 model of this exact horn. After some work by Matt Walters my instrument was in really fine condition, as this one is also. Based on my experience, I can safely say that compared with the Boosey&Hawkes Imperial baritone of the same vintage, this horn is inferior in most playing qualities.

    SA-Bari-01.jpg

    The SA horn is quite heavy with thicker brass than the equivalent Besson. The best thing that can be said about this horn is that it is extremely sturdy and has a fairly warm tone. The bore size of the SA horn is quite a bit smaller and I believe this affects pitch as well as response. The bore through the valves is something like .490 while the equivalent Besson product had a bore of a bit over .500. I suspect that part of this was due to obsolete tooling used from prior designs to make the valve sets. The pitch is not great with a very flat 2nd partial.

    This is an interesting horn, but I cannot imagine that short of use as a museum piece that it will be terribly practical in most bands.

    Doug

    PS I did use my horn for an outdoor New England Brass Band concert. Once.
    Adams E3 0.60 Sterling bell - Prototype top sprung valves
    Sterling Virtuoso 1065HGS - 300mm red brass bell
    Concord Band
    Winchendon Winds
    Townsend Military Band

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Hidden Valley, AZ
    Posts
    930
    Yes Doug, I've noticed on more than one occasion an SA band performing with noticeable intonation problems.
    1966 Besson 181 highly modified New Standard
    1915 York Bb tenorhorn original
    2019 Wessex Tornister

  4. #4
    I wouldn't even play a real Besson baritone of this vintage. The "harmony" instruments like baritone, tenorhorn, soprano, etc. just didn't get the same amount of engineering attention and development to their acoustic challenges as did the "solo" instruments like euphonium and cornet until around the 1980s. They're really just terrible, impossible to play in tune.
    --
    Barry

  5. #5
    I appreciate the feedback from folks who know more than I about such things! I won't remove the listing, but I will unpin it so there is no particular emphasis on it.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC4)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  6. Dave,

    I have a PDF document that provides history of the SA instruments manufacturing through its demise in 1972. It also includes serial number charts (much like the Besson ones) for dating by serial number. It is too large for me to post as an attachment. Can I send it to you and have you post it?

    Doug

    PS I received it from the SA Histoprian who has the records of the Judd St. manufactory.
    Adams E3 0.60 Sterling bell - Prototype top sprung valves
    Sterling Virtuoso 1065HGS - 300mm red brass bell
    Concord Band
    Winchendon Winds
    Townsend Military Band

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by daruby View Post
    Dave,

    I have a PDF document that provides history of the SA instruments manufacturing through its demise in 1972. It also includes serial number charts (much like the Besson ones) for dating by serial number. It is too large for me to post as an attachment. Can I send it to you and have you post it?

    Doug

    PS I received it from the SA Histoprian who has the records of the Judd St. manufactory.
    Sure! Email it to me and I'll put it somewhere - maybe in the Reference section, because it may apply to future topics about SA horns.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC4)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  8. #8
    I grew up playing on a Trumphonic Euphonium.
    Des


    Meet the Family
    Junior - Euphonium - 1906 - Henry Distin Mfg.
    Hastings - Trombone - 1952 - Boosey and Hawkes
    Bramwell - Euphonium - 1988 - Besson/Boosey and Hawkes (BE967)
    Donna - Baritone - 2012 - Dillon Music
    Margaret - Baritone - 2015 - Sterling1050HGS


    New York Staff Band :1991-1994
    Philadelphia Freedom Band - 2022-
    Lancaster British Brass Band (all hail the 2nd baritone) - 2022-
    Penn View Brass Band (you got it!! 2nd Baritone) 2022-

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