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Thread: Redesigning The Euphonium

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by RickF View Post
    Lyndon Baglin has always been one of my favorite euphonium soloists. What perfection! If you're not familiar just search for Lyndon Baglin playing "Rule Brittania". He uses alternate fingerings when necessary.
    Some of which I have adopted myself, depending on the role of the note I'm playing. The only false fingering I have ever used is middle A on 3rd valve on my E2, and occasionally 1/4 for top F and 4 for top G on my Bessons. Otherwise, I just get around it. What "it" may be.
    Nowt

    Retired

  2. Hello everyone,

    I have to admit that I have found this thread absolutely fascinating! I really hope that we may see some of these ideas featured in this thread bought to life in the near future!

    Best Wishes,

    Micah Dominic Parsons
    Best Wishes,

    Micah Dominic Parsons

    Website - https://mdpmicahdominicpar.wixsite.com/my-site
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  3. #83
    Sorry I'm very late to the party, but this is an interesting thread. Unfortunately, I was too busy to be reading forums until kinda recently. I've been trying to catch up now that I've had time.

    Overall, the Euphonium as we know it is really sophisticated and capable. It doesn't have a lot of intonation issues, and the ones it has are completely blown out of proportion. You can play it with almost any sort of reasonable mouthpiece and it's perfectly fine. There's not a lot to change that hasn't already been tried and likely abandoned for some reason. I admit that I kind of wish we had more options in the modern day, but at the same time, I don't know who would be buying them. Bigger is more popular.

    RE: Double compensating
    I actually ran the math on this many years ago, and it is actually possible (mathematically) to do this. For example, if a Bb horn compensated for both F and Eb, then the combination making BBb would actually be close enough to work. No doubt it would perform tragically, but it would work. Of course, finding room for all of this tubing, the extra weight, and the stuffiness would be awful. Could you combine the Enharmonic system and the compensating system? Technically, yes. You'd have a boat anchor of a horn, but sure. Do you want the extra leadpipe length that it takes to make the Enharmonic system work? Never tried it, but a healthy guess is...NO.

    I had the idea some time back that what would work best (IMO) is an inline 4 system when you combine 3 valve compensating with a single loop for 4+3. This gives you entirely enough tubing for low B natural while also providing effective compensation for the 1+3 combination. This is a great solution for us blow-to-pitch heathens that don't ever use 3 or 4 by itself, but might occasionally want to play in that range. Unfortunately, this introduces a big problem for bore distribution and valve alignment. Do you go single bore 4-valve compensating? Absolutely not. The other option is to make the 3rd and 4th valve have the same (larger) bore. Does that work? Dunno. I know that I don't want my 3rd and 4th valves to have like .040" extra throw, though.

    It's not what you want to hear, but the easiest solution to this problem is to just make a horn with an easier false tone partial. Find a way to make that work without the low end of 2nd partial being stuffy and you win. 4th valve not needed. Surely, modern engineering can do this.

    RE: 3+1 upright shape
    I'm surprised to see so much love for the 3+1 upright. This is one of the least ergonomic possible arrangements of an instrument. Not saying I want to go trumpetform, but seriously. You have no real grip on anything, the weight distribution is bad, and it's not much better with a shoulder strap. If you want the best ergonomics, then you need to find an arrangement that gives you the overall shape of the ovalform horns while still being a Euphonium. Is that possible? Yes. Will it be as attractive? Not sure, but probably not. I think that the most effective way to make this possible is to use the French style wrap (right hand on top bow) so that the bell is "longer". The overall horn would then be shorter, but the weight distribution would be much better, and better suited for a shoulder strap.

    Some new features that I'm surprised aren't a thing:
    * Seat peg
    Seriously? I don't think I've ever seen this on anything except for instruments that come close to the ground. Provide an adjustable peg to use the seat as a balance point. Yes, it would need all sorts of adjustment to work well for everyone and it would be ugly. Too bad. This combined with a shoulder strap should completely eliminate the ergonomics issues of the upright form factor. Yes, I think this is better than using a pillow.

    * Full-double Rotary w/ double rotor system (like some Wagner Tubas)
    I know it would be stupid heavy and completely unacceptable in most circles, but come on. You know it would be cool to have those super fast rotor valves and no return loops. What form factor? Dunno. It'd be ugly, but this could actually be done as a normal upright horn.

    * Just completely new alternative instrument...
    Ok, hear me out. Ovalform is really ergonomically good. Playing Bb music on an Eb instrument is pretty easy, as is reading BC. So uhh...just make a very small bore (.550"ish?) ovalform Eb Tuba no larger than the largest size of Rotary Euphonium. Would that work? I'm not sure, but I'd be willing to try it. I've tried this with my Eb Contrabass and it's not tragic, but that horn has a 13" bell and is considerably larger than what I'm picturing. I think if it were smaller, the sound would be richer, and the slotting would be practical. Compared to other instruments that have tried this sort of approach, this probably sounds stupid, but the fact that the BBb Tuba hasn't been replaced gives me some hope.
    Hobbyist. Collector. Oval rotary guy. Unpaid shill for Josef Klier mouthpieces.

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