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Thread: Evolution of marching band instrument from olds marching trombone to present

  1. Evolution of marching band instrument from olds marching trombone to present

    Andy Smith
    7:03 AM (8 hours ago)
    to me

    Hi Nelson,

    I’ll try to help you as best as I can, but I am no Tedd Waggoner, unfortunately. He’s enjoying his retirement, splitting his time between Florida and Indiana, and he’s doing really well, still playing some and still has forgotten more about Bach instruments than I know!

    Regarding the Bach marching baritone you’ve listed below, that’s correct that is identical to the YBH-301M, identical to the other, just with a different lacquer than the clear lacquer used on the Yamaha instruments. The reason for this being developed was that the Selmer Company knew that the Olds-produced Bach marching brass wasn’t up to what the marketplace required for more mature marching programs in the late 1980’s and 1990’s, so they reached out to Yamaha to see if they could collaborate with them. Bach was stenciled on the bell, and the rest was history. Once the Selmer Corporation merged with UMI and became Conn-Selmer, these (and the Holton/Yamaha stencils) were discontinued immediately, and Bach marching brass was never made again.

    The Specifications of the Bach 1106 model were as follows:


    • 10” Bell
    • .571” Bore
    • 19 ¾” Length
    • Yellow Brass construction


    Nothing other than the lacquer, engraving on the bell, and logo on case were different. The wall thickness, brass used, etc. were all identical between these two instruments. Please let me know if you have any questions!

    Andy Smith, DMA
    Product Manager, Repair Parts
    Conn-Selmer, Inc.
    600 Industrial Pkwy.
    Elkhart, IN 46516
    https://parts.conn-selmer.com

    Hi Andy,
    Could you elaborate on "Selmer Company knew that the Olds-produced Bach marching brass wasn’t up to what the marketplace required for more mature marching programs in the late 1980’s and 1990’s, so they reached out to Yamaha" I have been searching unsuccessfully for an Olds Marching Trombone O-21 for a long time. So I am curious about "what the marketplace required for more mature marching programs" given that Bach bought the tooling from Olds when they went out of business.

    Hi Nelson,
    With regards to the change in marching brass, there has been a big transition in the last 40 years regarding the sound concept of the marching arts. Gone are the days of the bright, aggressive, piercing sound that DCI and other marching bands had back in the 1980’s, and there’s a quest to make marching arts have a more “concert band” sound on the field. The way that has been done is getting bigger: bore size, bell size, more taper in leadpipes, etc. as a way to get the darker, broader sound that today’s groups covet in the marching arts.

    Nelson,
    Regarding the sound: it’s the difference between driving a Ford Escort vs. a Shelby Mustang. One car is meant for a certain style of driving, the other meant for something different. Yeah, you can attempt to make the Escort drive really fast, but it will never be a Mustang. And what’s the point of driving a Mustang 25 miles per hour to get groceries?

    Andy,
    So is the Olds Marching Trombone the Ford Escort and the Yamaha YBH-301 the Ford Mustang? The Mustang would be the faster car, but how does that relate to marching baritone/trombones in the music they play. Faster, louder, more powerful?

    I sent an inquiry to David Werden who has a website Euphonium-Tuba Form. I quoted part of your comment. Mr. Werden played with US Marine Band so I thought he would be knowledgeable about the subject, I just didn't know where to post it on his website. I sent this inquiry to him because I figured you had more important things to do than deal with me and Mr. Werden would be versed in what you were saying.

    Nelson
    Happy to help you where I can, always will take time to help nice people out like yourself, so please feel free to reach out to me with anything else you might need.

    Bad analogy in this case, I guess I should look at this more like as different vintages of the same car. Sure, they both do the same thing, but the older one has less technology, feels classic, but doesn’t have the modern nuances found in today’s vehicles. Both will get the job done, it’s just a different experience getting there. Sure, they both are great marching baritones, but one is larger bore, bigger bell, etc., and will play darker and a bit more “symphonic” than the Olds. Does that makes sense? I am curious what Mr. Werden will say to you, he’s a great guy!

    So as you can see I was having difficulty understanding the difference that Andy was talking about with the "Modern" marching band sound. So I thought I'd post this here and members could try to illuminate me. I've been after that Olds Marching Trombone O-21 for quite a ling time. I have posted WTB on several websites including this one, but now I wondered about the Yamaha YBH-301 Bach 1106 models. I tried to get Music and Arts to bring a Yamaha YBH-301 in to demo. They want me to pay for it first and then they will refund me if I don't like it. I sent they an email today stating that I thought their policy of "pay full price to demo" was "REDICULOUS".

    Hopefully someone can illuminate me.
    Last edited by davewerden; 03-02-2022 at 06:24 PM. Reason: Closed up space and took out email address

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