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Thread: Getzen bass trumpet - intonation

  1. #1
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    Getzen bass trumpet - intonation

    I have signed up with Taps for Veterans to sound Taps on 9/11. I had been given a Getzen bass trumpet and I thought I would try using it tomorrow. I used the Bach 12C mouthpiece that came with the horn.

    I started to warm up – the first two notes I played were concert F and concert D (i.e., up a major 6th). The D sounded really sour, and I checked it with my tuner app. The F was in tune, the Bb was in tune, but the D was halfway between a D and a Db.

    I tried it again with my trombone mouthpiece (6.5AL) – same intonation issue. I pulled out the trombone and the euphonium, and they played perfectly in tune. On the bass trumpet, I was able to force the D a little sharper by using a lot of pressure, pushing the horn against my lips. But that made the tone unstable and it still wasn't in tune. I got a little closer using 1-2 to play the D.

    Did you ever hear of any intonation problem like this? Anyway, I’ll use my euphonium to sound Taps tomorrow.
    Dean L. Surkin
    Mack Brass MACK-EU1150S, BB1, Kadja, and DE 101XTG9 mouthpieces
    Bach 36B trombone; pBone; Vincent Bach (from 1971) 6.5AL mouthpiece
    Steinway 1902 Model A, restored by AC Pianocraft in 1988; Kawai MP8, Yamaha KX-76
    See my avatar: Jazz (the black cockapoo) and Delilah (the cavapoo) keep me company while practicing

  2. #2
    If I remember correctly, when I play my Eb tuba, the D concert above the staff, is flat. I use 1-2 for that note. I have to keep reminding myself of that quirk every time I play it, which isn't too often. And strangely enough, most of the other notes above and below play fine, or pretty close to fine, regarding intonation. I have no explanation for why that happens to me, or to you, Dean. If you find out, let me know!
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, Wessex EP-100 Dolce Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Wessex TE-360 Bombino Eb Tuba
    Rapid City New Horizons & Municipal Bands (Euphonium)
    Black Hills Symphony Orchestra (Bass Trombone), Powder River Symphony, Gillette, WY (Tenor Trombone)
    Black Hills Brass Quintet (Tuba)

  3. #3
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    I played Taps today on my euphonium and left the bass trumpet sitting in its case. This is the first time I'm trying to post a video to this forum, and I hope it comes through.

    Edit: I replaced the Facebook video with the YouTube video hosted by Taps for Veterans.
    Last edited by dsurkin; 09-16-2021 at 10:53 AM.
    Dean L. Surkin
    Mack Brass MACK-EU1150S, BB1, Kadja, and DE 101XTG9 mouthpieces
    Bach 36B trombone; pBone; Vincent Bach (from 1971) 6.5AL mouthpiece
    Steinway 1902 Model A, restored by AC Pianocraft in 1988; Kawai MP8, Yamaha KX-76
    See my avatar: Jazz (the black cockapoo) and Delilah (the cavapoo) keep me company while practicing

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Morgan View Post
    If I remember correctly, when I play my Eb tuba, the D concert above the staff, is flat. I use 1-2 for that note.
    John:
    I was thinking about your comment and now I'm a little puzzled. On my Bb nine-foot horns, D4 is the fifth harmonic open. I can use open (fifth harmonic) or 1-2 (sixth harmonic) on instruments with valves and 1st position or modified fourth position on the trombone. For your Eb tuba, D4 is played with the 2nd valve in the eighth harmonic. If playing D4 with 1-2, that would be ninth harmonic. Did I misunderstand something here?

    The point I was trying to make about the Getzen bass trumpet was that I can't recall playing any horn (not my Pedlar trumpet, not the various King and Conn "American baritones" I used in school) that was so flat in the fifth harmonic. I will try playing the Getzen again with my tuner app, checking the notes from E2 up to Bb4.

    A further thought: It's likely not a coincidence, but on my euphonium, A4 played with 2 (eighth harmonic) is slightly flat and I have to use 1-2 (ninth harmonic). Rob Stattel, my teacher, says it's because the designers made the 2nd valve loop slightly longer to get better intonation with the 1-2 combination. It's possible, John, that your horn's designers made the same compromise.
    Dean L. Surkin
    Mack Brass MACK-EU1150S, BB1, Kadja, and DE 101XTG9 mouthpieces
    Bach 36B trombone; pBone; Vincent Bach (from 1971) 6.5AL mouthpiece
    Steinway 1902 Model A, restored by AC Pianocraft in 1988; Kawai MP8, Yamaha KX-76
    See my avatar: Jazz (the black cockapoo) and Delilah (the cavapoo) keep me company while practicing

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by dsurkin View Post
    John:
    I was thinking about your comment and now I'm a little puzzled. On my Bb nine-foot horns, D4 is the fifth harmonic open. I can use open (fifth harmonic) or 1-2 (sixth harmonic) on instruments with valves and 1st position or modified fourth position on the trombone. For your Eb tuba, D4 is played with the 2nd valve in the eighth harmonic. If playing D4 with 1-2, that would be ninth harmonic. Did I misunderstand something here?...
    Hey Dean,

    Sorry for the delay. Was off on a 5 day motorcycle trip all over Wyoming.

    I understand why you were puzzled, because I was mixing up my Eb tuba with a Bb instrument. The note on the Eb tuba that is really flat is the "G" concert (open or 1-2). This is the Eb tuba's written "E". If I play that note open, it is really flat, but playing it 1-2 is much better.

    Hope that clears it up. My bad, sorry.

    John
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, Wessex EP-100 Dolce Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Wessex TE-360 Bombino Eb Tuba
    Rapid City New Horizons & Municipal Bands (Euphonium)
    Black Hills Symphony Orchestra (Bass Trombone), Powder River Symphony, Gillette, WY (Tenor Trombone)
    Black Hills Brass Quintet (Tuba)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Morgan View Post
    Hey Dean,

    Sorry for the delay. Was off on a 5 day motorcycle trip all over Wyoming.

    I understand why you were puzzled, because I was mixing up my Eb tuba with a Bb instrument. The note on the Eb tuba that is really flat is the "G" concert (open or 1-2). This is the Eb tuba's written "E". If I play that note open, it is really flat, but playing it 1-2 is much better.

    Hope that clears it up. My bad, sorry.

    John
    Thanks for clearing that up, John. Regarding your motorcycle trip, in a word from TV of my youth: Kowa-bunga! [note my spelling, I'm referencing a 1950s TV show and not the later spelling of cowabunga]
    Dean L. Surkin
    Mack Brass MACK-EU1150S, BB1, Kadja, and DE 101XTG9 mouthpieces
    Bach 36B trombone; pBone; Vincent Bach (from 1971) 6.5AL mouthpiece
    Steinway 1902 Model A, restored by AC Pianocraft in 1988; Kawai MP8, Yamaha KX-76
    See my avatar: Jazz (the black cockapoo) and Delilah (the cavapoo) keep me company while practicing

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by dsurkin View Post
    Thanks for clearing that up, John. Regarding your motorcycle trip, in a word from TV of my youth: Kowa-bunga! [note my spelling, I'm referencing a 1950s TV show and not the later spelling of cowabunga]
    Yep, Kowa-Bunga indeed. That word was popularized by Chief Thunderthud (what a name) on the Howdy Doody show (40's and 50's). I still start off each morning when I wake up by saying "Howdy Doody" to my dear wife, Linda. And the motorcycle we rode on our trip is a 2021 Indian Springfield with a 111 cubic inch "Thunderstroke" engine! Pictures below.

    Now I am in a race against time to get my chops up to snuff (after not playing for almost a week) for an upcoming weekend in Gillette, WY doing a couple rehearsals on Saturday and a concert on Sunday. The Powder River Symphony.

    So a question to the members here. What do you do regarding your chops when you go off on an extended trip?

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    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, Wessex EP-100 Dolce Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Wessex TE-360 Bombino Eb Tuba
    Rapid City New Horizons & Municipal Bands (Euphonium)
    Black Hills Symphony Orchestra (Bass Trombone), Powder River Symphony, Gillette, WY (Tenor Trombone)
    Black Hills Brass Quintet (Tuba)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    NYC metro area
    Posts
    431
    Quote Originally Posted by John Morgan View Post
    Yep, Kowa-Bunga indeed. That word was popularized by Chief Thunderthud (what a name) on the Howdy Doody show (40's and 50's). I still start off each morning when I wake up by saying "Howdy Doody" to my dear wife, Linda. And the motorcycle we rode on our trip is a 2021 Indian Springfield with a 111 cubic inch "Thunderstroke" engine! Pictures below.

    Now I am in a race against time to get my chops up to snuff (after not playing for almost a week) for an upcoming weekend in Gillette, WY doing a couple rehearsals on Saturday and a concert on Sunday. The Powder River Symphony.

    So a question to the members here. What do you do regarding your chops when you go off on an extended trip?

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I was hoping you'd know the source, and I was right.

    I was on a trip to the lake area in northern Italy a few years ago. One of the men on the trip was a cornet player, aged 80, who brought his mouthpiece and music with him. Every night, he went to the basement of the hotel and practiced buzzing. Inspired by this, I took my mouthpiece with me when I went to visit my mother in Florida one year. Airport security was curious and puzzled, until someone higher up confirmed it really was a trombone mouthpiece (I didn't bother trying to explain what a euphonium was; I just told them it was a trombone mouthpiece). When I was actively playing piano (pre-arthritis), I'd try to take my vacations soon after one of my yearly recitals, so it was a week or so off before starting on my next year's program. Missing a week on piano never had as much effect on my playing as missing a week on the horns.
    Dean L. Surkin
    Mack Brass MACK-EU1150S, BB1, Kadja, and DE 101XTG9 mouthpieces
    Bach 36B trombone; pBone; Vincent Bach (from 1971) 6.5AL mouthpiece
    Steinway 1902 Model A, restored by AC Pianocraft in 1988; Kawai MP8, Yamaha KX-76
    See my avatar: Jazz (the black cockapoo) and Delilah (the cavapoo) keep me company while practicing

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