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Thread: Euphonium 1st Valve Weight

  1. #1

    Euphonium 1st Valve Weight

    The following chart shows the weight of the moving portion of the first valve. This includes the piston, valve stem, and finger button. When you first remove a piston, the top cap will come along. To do this measurement you need to remove the finger button, slide off the top cap, and replace the finger button. All else being equal, a lighter piston will move faster. This is only one of the "fast valve" factors, so don't obsess over the numbers below.

    As before, when I have multiple reports of one specific piston I will average the weights reported. This chart reports the values from the following thread:
    http://www.dwerden.com/forum/showthr...ht-Comparisons


    Brand "Model/etc." Grams
    Adams E3 96
    Adams Top Sprung 88
    Adams Sonic (non comp) 68
    Besson Imperial (1980s) 70
    Besson Prestige 84
    Boosey and Hawkes Sovereign 71
    Boosey and Hawkes Class A NS 1924 70
    Conn 24i 56
    Geneva Cardinal 102
    Jupiter JEP 1020 (non comp) 74.6
    King 2280 (non-comp) 92
    Sterling Bauerfeind Valve 94.5
    Wessex Festivo 90
    Wessex Sinfonico 103
    Willson 2900 (2012) 86
    Willson 2960 TA (Late 2000's) 91
    Last edited by davewerden; 10-19-2023 at 08:26 AM.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC3)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  2. #2
    Just added a Jupiter to the list (thanks, Alexander!)
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC3)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    2,368
    As you say, it's only one of the factors in contributing to "piston speed." I think there are at least the following as well:
    1. Piston diameter (more area, more drag, Other Things Being Equal)
    2. Piston length (more length, more drag -- OTBE)
    3. Bore diameter (larger bore, less drag? -- OTBE)
    4. Overall weight of the piston+stem+pads/shims+??? assembly
    5. Spring strength (OTBE)
    6. Guide size/weight/material (OTBE)
    7. Lubrication (OTBE)
    8. ???? other things I may not have thought of


    And EACH of these is "other things being equal" -- which they certainly aren't. So this is at least a 7x7 matrix of things that affect piston speed. Yikes. I'd be reluctant to focus on any one of them as an optimization target since the aggregate of the others might overwhelm it.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

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