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Thread: 4 + 1 for low B flat

  1. 4 + 1 for low B flat

    Maybe most people already know this, but thought I'd share something that I recently discovered for myself...

    I have found that it is possible to use valves 4 + 1 for low concert B flat (instead of no valves). I find this useful for making a subtle attack in a softer passage of music. More tubing results in more dark, less bark, so to speak.

  2. #2
    It's good that you discovered this. I use it all the time, as well as some other close fingerings in that range. You'll find much of this discussed here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nklNJEj_Fk0

    The theory and technique behind this is covered in my "Advanced Fingering Guide."

    Here is a shorter example using notes in that range:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NV2Zy45DnY
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC3)
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  3. On trombone, we use trigger flat 3rd for fast passages where going back to 1st position is impractical. You'll have to push that note down to get it in tune, or if it's fast, just don't worry about it. Alternate fingerings/positions are done for very different reasons between bone and valved instruments. As a trombone player who grew up on a lot of alternate positions, it's sometimes hard to get my head around how euph players deal with it all.

  4. Thank you for the informative videos!

  5. #5
    I'll definitely do V+flat3 on trombone for B-flat as well for added resistance if I need to be really soft and smooth. Depends on the valve. Works really well on a rotor. Less so on a thayer. 2nd movement of Saint-Saens Organ Symphony comes to mind.
    --
    Barry

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by daniel76309 View Post
    Maybe most people already know this, but thought I'd share something that I recently discovered for myself...

    I have found that it is possible to use valves 4 + 1 for low concert B flat (instead of no valves). I find this useful for making a subtle attack in a softer passage of music. More tubing results in more dark, less bark, so to speak.
    Interesting you make the point about subtle attack - on bottom C if the music demands it, a tongueless "fah" production works well. First note of Resurgam being a good example. I use 1/4 for trills (Dublin's Fair City needs a D/C trill) but nothing else because as I get older the more value I find in only using 1st, 2nd, and 3rd valves. I can imagine there are chords and ensemble writing where a flat pitch dull sounding note might be a great use. (It's a disappointment to me as to how so few virtuosos can alter their sound - I believe Roger Bobo made the point about euphoniums always sounding "nice" - an overstatement from a professional contrarian - but there is a little merit in what he said)

    As for bark? I can bark a bottom Ab or G, but not a C. Curious how we are all different.
    Nowt

    Retired

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