Valve trombone advice, please!

[Saltycookie]

I play the euphonium in a concert band. There is a shortage of trombone players in a local big band and currently I am in the band as a third trombone player with my euphonium. I am thinking of purchasing a valve trombone but I know nothing about trombone. I looked online stores but there are so many different kinds... Any advice what to look or any recommendation for the instrument?

[Rodgeman]

Hello and welcome.

Trombone was my first instrument. Your best bet would be to go to the online trombone chat for research: https://trombonechat.com . Most valve trombones are not very good. Your best bet would be to learn to play a slide trombone. See if your school has a trombone for you to learn on and they may also provide lessons before spending the money on a trombone. I used school horns throughout middle and high school. Talk to your band director and or your prove lesson teacher about this. While they are similar you need to play them a little bit differently.

Since you use a euphonium with four valves you might want to invest in a .547 (large) bore f-attachment trombone after you have played for a while.
Some used ones to look for:
Bach 42B
Conn 88h
King 4B

Slide charts and info:
- The f-attachment is your fourth valve.
- No valves is first position
- 1st valve is third position
- 2nd valve is second position
- 1st and 2nd valve is fourth position
- 2nd and 3rd valve is 5th position
- 1st and 3rd (or 4th) valve is sixth position (or trigger and 1st position)
- 1st, 2nd, and 3rd (or 2nd and 4th ) valves are seventh position ( or trigger and 2nd position)

Here i a pretty good resource for beginning trombone info: https://norlanbewley.com/bewleymusic...ne-tips-music/

I hope this helps.

[Richard III]

I've covered the trombone part for years in small jazz bands. I've used a marching french horn, a mellophone and a marching baritone. I've found the closest is a marching baritone. There is also a marching trombone, also called a flugabone. They are costly, but so is a quality valve trombone. I know a local trumpet player who has been doing the valve trombone for years in a local big band. It works. And you can immediately step in and play.

[Saltycookie]

Thanks. The the online trombone chat looks good! I wish I could learn to play a slide trombone but I don't have time for it (I am a mother of two young kids and a farmer...) and I am not so young meaning it requires two...three times more time of practice to acquire new stuff than when I was young That is the reason why I am thinking of getting a valve trombone.

[Saltycookie]

Thanks! I went to an online store for a valve trombone but there are different kinds and just don't know which one is for me...

[davewerden]

I would suggest looking at the specs and choose the one with the largest bore. I see a lot that are .500. Euphoniums are typically in the range of .560 (American-style horns) to .592 or more. A .500 will feel a bit tight. But I have not looked at enough to know if there is a "range" of bores available among the brands.

[Rodgeman]

The other suggestion for the King Flugabone is a good one.

Here is one for sale by a music store: https://reverb.com/item/3368359-king-1130-flugabone

Here is another:

https://reverb.com/item/14737620-kin...ching-trombone

[euphlight]

In Highschool and my 1st year of university, I used a Yahama 354V to play in jazz band. It was a fairly good valve bone. At some point, you will have to learn to play the slide trombone. Since you are playing 3rd trombone, you will want to get a trombone with a larger bore like what Rodgeman suggested.

[hyperbolica]

As a trombone player who plays some valves, I completely avoid valve trombones except the marching compact trombone (flugabone) because they can't glis, are largely out of tune, are stuffy to play, generally not as well made as most pro trombones, and they simply don't make a large bore valve bone that you would want to play. Valve trombone works ok as a solo instrument, but not as a section horn. Especially on 3rd you're going to need a larger horn with a 4th valve - and something you can play in tune, because you might have to play below the staff. Most 3rd bones are going to be using a trigger trombone (depends on the tunes the band plays), and you'd need a 4v compensating setup to do that, which is somewhere between rare and non-existent. They don't really make a good instrument for this application because there really isn't any call for it. You'd have a better chance replacing a bass trombone with a cimbasso or small bore F tuba.

[bbocaner]

well, for big band use a small-bore valve trombone would be OK. I think the Jupiter is .500 and the Yamaha is .500 and those are both decent. The King and Bach are both smaller because they use trumpet pistons.

however, I'll echo what others have said in that the sound of a valve trombone is just not satisfying when compared to slide trombones. I'd say it would be valid to use as a solo instrument where you're going for the unique sound, but in a section it's a disappointment. Taking some time to learn the slide is not a bad idea!

[JTJ]

Here's a great example of valve trombone as a solo instrument, the jazz player Bob Brookmeyer, playing "Smoke Gets in Your Eyes." In his time he was famous as a valve trombonist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ore4UO6MiME

John

[dsurkin]

I play the euphonium in a concert band. There is a shortage of trombone players in a local big band and currently I am in the band as a third trombone player with my euphonium. I am thinking of purchasing a valve trombone but I know nothing about trombone. I looked online stores but there are so many different kinds... Any advice what to look or any recommendation for the instrument?

My experience may be relevant. I joined a local orchestra, playing in the trombone section, on my euphonium. When I first joined, they had no trombone players, so I was the entire section. Then we recruited two more trombone players, and I agreed to play the bass trombone parts (since I have a compensating four-valve horn). More personnel changes, and I was playing first trombone again. The tuba player had picked up a Conn trombonium, which he loaned to me. This definitely helped the tonal blend (particularly since I was leading the section).

I found an open-box p-Bone at a good price. I bought it to see if I could handle the slide positions. I admit that I was mostly worried about my intonation (my main instrument for most of my life has been piano, and if there's an intonation problem I call the tuner). I switched off between p-Bone and trombonium, depending upon the difficulty of the piece. Eventually I found a used Bach 36B trombone, bought that, and now play that exclusively in the orchestra.

For concert bands, I continue to sit in the euphonium section. But I absolutely think that the trombone suits the orchestra better. Oh yeah, I played a solo on euphonium once in one of the orchestra concerts, but that was a Barat composition intended for trombone or euphonium. My granddaughter is currently using the p-Bone.

[davewerden]

OK, here is one from left field! How about a Wessex Superbone? It has 3 valves plus a slide, and it's a dual-bore (.500-.525) which might help a little.

In its normal use, the valves are operated with the left hand so the right hand is free to work the slide. However, I ASSUME one could lock the slide (most trombone slides have a rotating lock to hold it in first position) and then play with the right hand. Then you would have 2 nice advantages:

1. you could learn the slide as you go, with an easy fall-back to valves.

2. you could also play parts that would normally require 4 valves if you worked the valves with your left hand and used the slide to find intonation on notes below low E concert. You should be able to get down to a C or C# concert this way.

https://us.wessex-tubas.com/collecti...trombone-pb930

[hyperbolica]

The super bone would be an interesting compromise. I've played 3rd in big band on 525 bore, and this is 500/525. Both the valves and slide are "kinda funky". The slide is short and positioned a bit further out than normal slides. And if you are using the slide, I assume the valves are played left handed. Maynard Ferguson made the Holton version famous, if not exactly popular. These are potentially really cool. But they're just oddball enough that they could also be borderline unplayable as either slide or valve instrument. The reviews for the Wessex aren't bad. If you go that direction, please let us know how it goes. Best of luck.

[bbocaner]

the wessex superbone is not a bad idea! you could always have the valves to fall back on, and the bore and bell is not out of the realm of appropriate for 3rd seat in a big band. The original Holton was kind of an odd mix with a super small bore and a really big 9" bell, but they seem to have come to a good compromise with the wessex version.