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Thread: Question on the turn

  1. #1
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    Question on the turn

    "Robin Adair", No. 1 of Arban's melodies in the Art of Phrasing has a turn in measure 6. The direction of the 1st curve (down) tells me that it's an inverted turn. Am I correct? I've seen several videos of that melody played on YouTube, and it sounds as if they're playing a regular turn. In one video, a trumpet teacher states that it is to be played as a regular turn (base note, then next note up . . . ). What am I missing?

  2. #2
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    Hmm, in my Arban's book, I show the turn (gruppetto) on "Robin Adair" as an ascending turn.

    Here is a little image:
    Click image for larger version. 

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    The top left example is an ascending turn, like the one in the "Robin Adair" piece. The top right example is an inverted or descending turn.
    Last edited by John Morgan; 06-25-2021 at 06:49 PM.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium,
    1973 F. E. Olds & Son Studio Model T-31 Baritone
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Year Round Except Summer:
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by davewerden View Post
    Interesting question! I've always done it going up first, but apparently that is not the only way. See the following two images from the Library of Congress:

    Attachment 8408

    Attachment 8409
    Do you have the image that you intended to post? Or the part of the image? I see no turns in the image.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium,
    1973 F. E. Olds & Son Studio Model T-31 Baritone
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Year Round Except Summer:
    Kingdom of the Sun (KOS) Concert Band, Ocala, FL (Euphonium)
    KOS Brass Quintet (Trombone, Euphonium)
    Summer Only:
    Rapid City Municipal Band, Rapid City, SD (Euphonium)
    Rapid City New Horizons Band (Euphonium)

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by John Morgan View Post
    Do you have the image that you intended to post? Or the part of the image? I see no turns in the image.
    I just deleted the post. My eyes are tired and I didn't notice that the written-out turn "started" on the same note and then went up.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
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    I took a pic of the measure I'm referring to, but don't know how to attach the image. Any help?

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    Click image for larger version. 

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  7. #7
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    When you write a post, there are a bunch of icons on the top of the posting box. Hover your mouse over the ones toward the right end, one of them is "image". Put your cursor in the post where you want to insert a picture (jpg or png for example), then click the image icon. Then you can upload the picture from your computer to the post. It will show up as something like this "[ATTACH=CONFIG][/ATTACH]". But when you post the message, the image will appear. Looks like my latest motorcycle got posted as I was writing this post, oops. Oh well, its a nice bike.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 2021 Indian Springfield.jpg  
    Last edited by John Morgan; 06-25-2021 at 07:29 PM.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium,
    1973 F. E. Olds & Son Studio Model T-31 Baritone
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Year Round Except Summer:
    Kingdom of the Sun (KOS) Concert Band, Ocala, FL (Euphonium)
    KOS Brass Quintet (Trombone, Euphonium)
    Summer Only:
    Rapid City Municipal Band, Rapid City, SD (Euphonium)
    Rapid City New Horizons Band (Euphonium)

  8. #8
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    Click image for larger version. 

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  9. #9
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    Indeed!! Your turn is an inverted turn! The one in my Arban's book is ascending. Very interesting.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium,
    1973 F. E. Olds & Son Studio Model T-31 Baritone
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Year Round Except Summer:
    Kingdom of the Sun (KOS) Concert Band, Ocala, FL (Euphonium)
    KOS Brass Quintet (Trombone, Euphonium)
    Summer Only:
    Rapid City Municipal Band, Rapid City, SD (Euphonium)
    Rapid City New Horizons Band (Euphonium)

  10. #10
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    John, I'm working off my phone -- no computer, no mouse. Maybe that limits me.

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