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Thread: LOCKED NOW, SEE NEW THREAD: Will I Finally Replace My Wick 4AL with a _____?

  1. #1

    LOCKED NOW, SEE NEW THREAD: Will I Finally Replace My Wick 4AL with a _____?

    For the latest, and for the answer of what I was testing, see this new thread:
    http://www.dwerden.com/forum/showthr...ults-and-MORE!


    I'm seriously testing a new mouthpiece and I'd like some opinions if you have a spare 3 minutes and 44 seconds. I only identify them with RED and BLUE. Opinions are welcome!

    https://youtu.be/OAhyWsIw0EQ

    Last edited by davewerden; 03-16-2021 at 03:03 PM.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC4)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  2. #2
    I love that you've posted these! I had noticed that some of your recent YouTube videos were not using a 4AL and was really curious to know what it was, so this will be a fun way to find out.

    You sound great on both of them, and each of them had moments where I preferred one over the other. I think more often than not I preferred red. To my highly untrained ear it sounded a little more clear and with a kind of purity to the tone. Blue seemed to get a bit edgy for me in some places. Red sounded like some of the intervals came across as a little smoother as well.

    Can't wait to find out the results. Based on mouthpiece shape in some of the videos I have an idea but I'm not totally sure.

    I noticed that you can see the mouthpieces through the grey box when the camera is on your face and at one point you move so the mouthpiece is visible outside the grey box. I tried to use the honor system and look away to not give anything away, ha.

  3. Its a close run thing but I tend to agree with aroberts for much the same reasons. Red wins if it feels right but its a narrow margin.

  4. #4
    Thanks for the 2 commenters so far! Would love to hear more. (I'm going to remain mostly quiet for a while so I don't pollute any potential responses.)
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC4)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  5. It was a pretty close call. Players with solid technique tend to sound like themselves no matter what they are playing. That said I preferred the tone of the blue. What aroberts called edgy sounded to me to be livelier and with a more forward presence (in a good way). On the other hand, I think you sounded more at ease with the red mouthpiece. Was I hearing it wrong or was the pitch on the high G in the Holst a little harder to tame with the blue?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    Summerville (SC)
    Posts
    250
    Hello Dave, as my screen reader software won't tell me what color corresponds to which MP, I'll use #1 and #2 instead...

    I listened to the clips twice through my Plantronic USB headset, as it is more resolving than the speakers of my laptop...

    My preference in general goes to #2:

    * Overall #2 seems to be more sure footed than #1... Attacks appear faster and it might be nimbler to "start speaking" and transitioning between notes... Hence delivering a sense of greater liveliness.

    * #2 might be providing slightly more intense upper harmonics as well as crisper bass range.

    * #2 yields a larger and more emotionally intense sound-scape than #1.

    * #2 might also yield slightly more precise intonation control than #1.

    But it would be interesting to listen to some comparisons with slow elegiac fragments that feature a broad range of expressions/dynamics from deep bass to treble.

    Looking forward to finding out what MPs are #1 and #2... And which one you Dave prefer.

    Saluti, Guido
    Wessex EP104 Festivo + DC4, SM4U

  7. #7
    Hi Dave,
    To my ear, I preffered your excerpts played on the Blue Mouthpiece. To make a comparison, I find the Red Mouthpiece more mellow, warm and dark where the Blue Mouthpiece was more brilliant, brighter and clearer. If I had to guess, I would say that the Red Mouthpiece was the Wick 4AL, but I can be totally wrong.
    These are just my observations of course.
    Vito
    Last edited by Vito; 03-13-2021 at 03:08 PM.
    2019 Besson Sovereign 967T silverplated - Denis Wick SM4U

  8. A bit of a different take from me. I'll approach this as if a student were testing mouthpieces. Not to imply I am an accomplished anything as you truly are, but it would seem red is a little too large for the player with the current approach. It seems there is an effort to fill it that might work if playing in a large venue where a large volume of air were needed but not here. Blue sounds a bit smaller in cup size and more easily managed. That produces a more focused sound palette. I would say blue is moving in the right direction. I would go one step further and say another change in the blue direction might hit the mark right on. It might be just a small change in cup contours or bore size.
    Richard

    1935 Conn 64I Baritone
    Mouthpieces: Too many to list and growing

  9. David,

    I am just a bit ambivalent here. Of course you sound wonderful on both mouthpieces and I enjoyed listening. The differences I heard were consistent across all of the snippets:

    1. Red has a warmer/rounder sound to me. The overtones are not as distinct but sound more "blended". The tonal differences on the Second Suite lick definitely favored Red IMO.
    2. Blue is crisper. I feel like your articulation is just a bit better with Blue. It does have a more "forward" sound and I think a bit more high overtones. The articulation differences between Red and Blue sounded fairly pronounced on the Czardas lick in favor of Blue.

    Both are great, but overall, I probably lean a bit more to the sound of Red.

    Doug
    Sterling Virtuoso 1065HGS & Adams E3 Prototype 0.70 Top Sprung valves
    Sterling Virtuoso 1050HGS baritone
    New England Brass Band
    Winchendon Winds/Townsend Military Band

  10. #10
    Hard to tell on the first couple of pieces with the piano. I listened several times. Both nice. I tend toward the Blue mouthpiece. It sounded crisper, clearer, and more lively. Those are qualities that are ever so slightly more evident in the Blue piece, although either mouthpiece works perfectly well with you and that horn. If I was stranded on an island with my euphonium and those two pieces and a shark came along and ate one, I could be totally happy with whichever one he didn't eat. And at that point, I would be more careful where I left my mouthpiece(s).

    Furthermore, Red used to be my favorite color when I was young, however, over the years, I have sort of migrated to Blue as my favorite color, so there is some unintended bias built into my findings above. Maybe #1 and #2 next time. I AM being silly now.

    BTW, are you single or double tonging Czardas? I play that piece a bit faster and absolutely have to double tongue. If you were double tonging, that was extremely clean tonguing for double tonguing at that speed.
    Last edited by John Morgan; 03-13-2021 at 10:56 AM.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, Wessex EP-100 Dolce Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Wessex TE-360 Bombino Eb Tuba
    Rapid City New Horizons & Municipal Bands (Euphonium)
    Black Hills Symphony Orchestra (Bass Trombone), Powder River Symphony, Gillette, WY (Tenor Trombone)
    Black Hills Brass Quintet (Tuba)

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