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Thread: Size 12C vs 6.5AL for Yamaha 321

  1. Size 12C vs 6.5AL for Yamaha 321

    Hi everyone,

    I had a new student today who has been playing for 2 years (10 years old) and he is playing on a Jupiter 12C mouthpiece and Yamaha 321.

    His tone has an very aggressive edge / bark to it, and I'm thinking it comes from the shallowness of the 12C mouthpiece.

    I gave him my Bach 5G to try and his tone immediately improved but he's lost a lot of range. I think he is about 2 to 3 years from the 5G.

    I then gave him a Wick 6BS to try and that took the edge away but still the tone wasn't all that great.

    So I'm thinking for putting him onto the Faxx 6.5AL (small shank) for the next 2 years. Just wondering if anyone has tried both and can tell me if the difference is worth the trouble?

    Regards
    Ted

  2. #2
    I would agree with your thinking that a 6-1/2AL would be a good "in the meantime" mouthpiece. It should help his tone and is kinda the mainstream choice when a student starts to get good but hasn't the strength yet to handle the Wick mouthpieces. It has a decent, though small, tone and is easy on the endurance.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    YouTube: dwerden
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  3. #3
    If you want something small and deep, try a Schilke 44E4. It's deeper than the 6.5AL, similar cup diameter to the 12C, and has a good rim for small embouchure. Throat isn't as large, obviously. 6.5AL is probably better if you insist on stretching him, but that seems like such a young age that he has plenty of time for that. I've never played a Yamaha 321, so I'm not 100% sure what kind of sound you should expect from it, but it will be better than the 12C.
    Hobbyist. Collector. Oval rotary guy. Unpaid shill for Josef Klier mouthpieces.

  4. Thank you for your replies!

    I'm worried the Schilke deep cups may be too deep for him at this stage (if the 51D and 52E2 is anything to go by).

    Any thoughts on the Bach 9 in context my question? It seems to be similar cup depth to 6.5AL with a smaller rim so it might serve as one that suits him right now, and I'll move him to 5G as soon as he grows out of it...

    I just wish he wasn't started on something so small and shallow, but I guess every new student comes with their own set of issues.

  5. What about the Schilke 46D? Really easy playing and not too large.
    Richard

    1935 Conn 64I Baritone
    Mouthpieces: Too many to list and growing

  6. #6
    For reasons unbeknownst to me, the 44E4 is actually shallower than the 51D. It's very similar to the old Besson 10, if you've ever seen one of those. Besson 10 has a better (larger) throat. Schilke has the better rim shape.
    Hobbyist. Collector. Oval rotary guy. Unpaid shill for Josef Klier mouthpieces.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by superted View Post

    Any thoughts on the Bach 9 in context my question? It seems to be similar cup depth to 6.5AL with a smaller rim so it might serve as one that suits him right now, and I'll move him to 5G as soon as he grows out of it...
    I used a Bach 9 back when I was about that age and, for an eleven year old, was told I sounded pretty good. Either a 9 or the easier to find 11 (with no letters) should work. I recall Doug Elliott, in a trombonechat posting, calling the 9 a really good mouthpiece. Finally, a recently departed fixture in the central Ohio trombone scene used a Bach 9 on his 36B his whole career. It worked for him for everything from ragtime to symphonic playing.

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