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Thread: Discussion of Oil and Grease

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    Summerville (SC)
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    483
    Hello Gary, I looked up Dow-Corning High Vacuum Grease on Amazon.... Turns out it is available in packages as small as 0.5 ounces for $4.95 plus shipping, in addition to 1 ounce, 2 ounces, and 5 ounces for example:

    https://www.amazon.com/Dow-Corning-H...re-bullets-btf

    My concern is the almost total insolubility of the material.... How do you remove it completely from your hands after applying it to eupho slides? And is there any toxicity to it?

    Saluti, Guido
    M5050L - DC2&3, SM2&4U, BT16, Carbonaria Heavy & New
    Wessex EP104 Festivo - available
    Carolbrass CCR7772 Bb cornet - Available

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by RickF View Post
    Another vote for Blue Juice. It lubricates well AND helps keep the valves cleaner. The only complaint I hear is it has a stronger odor. I don’t notice that anymore. Matt of Dillon Music in NJ was quoted as saying, “Use Blue Juice. You’ll thank me later”.
    i agree 100% with Rick on this, that Blue Juice is all the lubricant you need. The petroleum oil kills the bacteria that otherwise feed on synthetic oil and result in the “green slime” biofilm that tends to grow in horns lubricated with Hetman’s.

    The other thing I would suggest and Blue Juice allows you to do without guilt is to “use lots” of oil, rather than buying very expensive oil and conserving it. This type of low force sliding contact needs lots of lubrication of some kind. Buy the “studio’ size bottles and don’t skimp.

    Don

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
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    Quote Originally Posted by guidocorona View Post

    My concern is the almost total insolubility of the material.... How do you remove it completely from your hands after applying it to eupho slides? And is there any toxicity to it?
    It appears to be less toxic than tomato juice:

    https://aspen.conncoll.edu/media/web...uum_Grease.pdf

    I just wipe my hands on paper towels, but if you're concerned you could always use plastic or latex gloves.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
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    2,369

    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by djwpe View Post
    The petroleum oil kills the bacteria that otherwise feed on synthetic oil and result in the “green slime” biofilm that tends to grow in horns lubricated with Hetman’s.
    So it's all you Blue Juice users who are DESTROYING OUR PLANETARY ECOSYSTEM? Oops, another digression. Sorry.

    But exactly what strains of bacteria in our instruments feed on the synthetic oils that we're all using? I've sure never noticed any slime from using a variety of synthetic oils.

    I don't use Hetman's -- way too many horror stories about various slimes with it. But don't generalize from Hetman's to "synthetic oil". And I don't recall its being established that the slime produced with/by Hetman's involves bacterial action. References? (Not being snotty about this. Just really curious if this has been determined since we've been speculating about the cause here for several years.) A lot of people absolutely love Hetman's and have no problems with it.

    The other thing I would suggest and Blue Juice allows you to do without guilt is to “use lots” of oil, rather than buying very expensive oil and conserving it. This type of low force sliding contact needs lots of lubrication of some kind. Buy the “studio’ size bottles and don’t skimp.
    Well, I feel that I'm striking a small blow on behalf of the endangered planetary bacteria. Also, I just buy expensive oil and then don't conserve it -- and find myself curiously bereft of guilt. Life's too short. Besides, you don't actually have to conserve it, since it lasts so much longer in application. Look at the revolution that synthetic lubricants have yielded for trombone slide lubrication -- where I suspect that pretty much nobody uses anything else any longer (if you can even get non-synthetic trombone slide lubricants).

    If you really want to save money, do what a bunch of the old tuba guys do: get ultrapure lamp oil (kerosene) by the quart and use it on your valves every 15 minutes or so. It is in fact an excellent light lubricant, entirely "natural" (well, modulo all that refining), very inexpensive ($8/quart or less), slightly stinky (but nothing like Blue Juice ), washes off fast, and doesn't give a particularly attractive flavor to your instrument. But some people really dig it.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  5. So can we generally say, the "best," subjectively and depending on whether you want to go synthetic or natural, are probably Hetman or Blue Juice?

    Would there be any issue with mixing different kinds? (I'm picturing combining regular unleaded and premium in your gas tank.) I assume no with eyebrows raised at the ignorance of the question, but I do want to be sure.

    So I busted out the old anhydrous lanolin today to check it. It smells like youth and high emotion, but not rancid like I expected. It hasn't hardened. Any reason not to use what I have?

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Hidden Valley, AZ
    Posts
    1,034
    I know some euph players, sworn they do drink da juice...

    Dennis

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    338
    Here in the Netherlands, La Tromba is a very popular petroleum-based valve oil brand. Never failed me. I don't know if it's available in the USA but if it is, give it a try.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
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    Quote Originally Posted by lzajmom View Post
    So can we generally say, the "best," subjectively and depending on whether you want to go synthetic or natural, are probably Hetman or Blue Juice?
    No -- though I'm not even sure what this means with the "subjectively" in it. Once you throw that in you can pretty much say anything you like.

    Would there be any issue with mixing different kinds? (I'm picturing combining regular unleaded and premium in your gas tank.) I assume no with eyebrows raised at the ignorance of the question, but I do want to be sure.
    You'll see a lot of people warn about this. I've never seen any such result myself but am not ideological about it. However, why would you want to mix different kinds?

    So I busted out the old anhydrous lanolin today to check it. It smells like youth and high emotion, but not rancid like I expected. It hasn't hardened. Any reason not to use what I have?
    No. Use it. I always liked the smell. You know, the Roman military used it as water-proofing on their outer clothing. It probably improved the overall odor of the legion (or whatever). It's got history on its side.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  9. #19
    Interesting talk about the slimy biofilm in the valve area. I've been wondering why they build up rather fast lately and wondered whether it was food particles, or it was because it's a relatively new instrument, or because I just switched over from Yamaha valve Oil to Hetmann or a combination of all of the above. I have to clean the valves every other week or suffer from unresponsive valves.
    "Never over complicate things. Accept "bad" days. Always enjoy yourself when playing, love the sound we can make on our instruments (because that's why we all started playing the Euph)"

    Euph: Yamaha 642II Neo - 千歌音
    Mouthpiece: K&G 4D, Denis Wick 5AL

    https://soundcloud.com/ashsparkle_chika
    https://www.youtube.com/user/AshTSparkle/

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    West Palm Beach, FL
    Posts
    3,853
    Christiane, I had trouble using Hetman valve oil due to slimy buildup in my valves. To a lesser degree too with Yamaha synthetic oil. To find out more, read this thread:

    Switched to Blue Juice:
    http://www.dwerden.com/forum/showthr...092#post126092

    be sure to read on pg3 too for Cebunker’s post regarding ‘synthetic oils’.
    Rick Floyd
    Miraphone 5050 - Warburton BJ / RF mpc
    YEP-641S (recently sold)
    Doug Elliott - 102 rim; I-cup; I-9 shank


    "Always play with a good tone, never louder than lovely, never softer than supported." - author unknown.
    Symphonic Band of the Palm Beaches
    El Cumbanchero (Raphael Hernandez, arr. Naohiro Iwai)
    Chorale and Shaker Dance
    (John Zdechlik)

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