Sterling Virtuoso Main Tuning Slide Trigger Sticking

[bdawley81]

I am growing increasingly frustrated at my tuning slide trigger mechanism. I have a relatively new Sterling Virtuoso Custom, and this sticking is driving me crazy. It doesn't gum up every time I use it, but it has at the worst times. There's no way this horn should already be having issues. I can confirm that there has been no damage to the horn. I currently use Denis Wick Ultra Pure Linkage and Lever Key Oil. Am I missing something with the screws on the assembly? Thanks for the help!

[davewerden]

When I had a triggered Sterling, I used trombone slide cream. Oils and greases were sticking, but the slide cream worked great. I had to add a little every few days, and I cleaned and re-creamed it every couple weeks or so.

[jkircoff]

What part of the trigger is sticking? If it's the slide then Dave's suggestion should do the trick. If it's something more mechanical then you might want to reach out to Paul Riggett.

[highpitch]

As far as trigger slides go, on my horn the usual suspects would guarantee sticking every session. This works very well on ALL slides:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPER-LUBE-...from=R40&rt=nc

DDG

[bdawley81]

I'm pretty confident it's the slide (not the main tuning slide, but the one attached to the main tuning slide). On another note, my 4th valve is awful noisy. I have Mead springs in all my valves, but the 4th is the only noisy one.

[jkircoff]

I'm pretty confident it's the slide (not the main tuning slide, but the one attached to the main tuning slide). On another note, my 4th valve is awful noisy. I have Mead springs in all my valves, but the 4th is the only noisy one.

Which part of the valve compression / release cycle is noisy? Most of the time in my experience noisy valves result from felts that are worn out and need replacement. A relatively new instrument could need felt replacement if it's heavily used.

[bdawley81]

Which part of the valve compression / release cycle is noisy? Most of the time in my experience noisy valves result from felts that are worn out and need replacement. A relatively new instrument could need felt replacement if it's heavily used.

You're probably right. I'll look into that.

[davewerden]

When an instrument is stored in its case in typical fashion, the 4th valve is at the bottom. Water will probably soak up the felt on top of the piston and make it noisy. First thing to check is just to remove the piston and press on the felt/pad on top of the piston with your finger. If it squishes, there's your answer.

[daruby]

Tuning slide trigger and noisy valves

Some tips on servicing your Sterling.

First: I have gotten fantastic results on my 9 year old Sterling's tuning slide trigger mechanism by:

1. Extremely thorough cleaning of the the slide and the receiving tubes the slide goes into. I use hot soapy water to clean the slide and an old t-shirt and Brass-Saver cleaning brush to swab out the tubes.
2. When the horn was new, I used Wright's Silver Cream to polish the legs of the tuning slide to ensure smoother action. This must be done judiciously as you are not trying to "hone" the fit, just get a smoother action.
3. I use Hetman #6 slide oil on the slide and on any pivot points. It doesn't washout easily. I found trombone creme a bit too light after it got wet.

Second: I use standard Besson-style finger button, top cap, and piston felts. The piston and finger button felts are synthetic and are receptive to being washed in hot soapy water and dried out to get rid of accumulated oil and moisture. I change the felts out about once a year. I purchase replacement supplies each year on my trips to England when I am at IBBSS, but they are readily available via eBay as well.

Third: For the fourth valve, it accumulates moisture more than the other three so felt cleaning/replacement is more important. Also, I bend the tab holding the valve in just a bit so that the valve is held slightly off the valve cap, thus not compressing the felts.

I might mention, that all three of the service procedures I describe above were also done on my Besson Prestige and the second two on ALL euphoniums I have owned since my 1980 Sovereign. Also, I use Mead Springs on my Sterling as well.

[Jasonium]

When I had a triggered Sterling, I used trombone slide cream. Oils and greases were sticking, but the slide cream worked great. I had to add a little every few days, and I cleaned and re-creamed it every couple weeks or so.

Did you mix water with it like a trombone player would?

[davewerden]

Did mix water with it like a trombone player would?

Nope. Didn't need to.

[daruby]

Tuning your Sterling trigger!

Ben,

The issue here with Euphonium triggers is not just lubrication, but also cleanliness and how it is serviced. Here is how I got the trigger on my Sterling to work smooth as silk (did the same to my brand new 2007 Besson 2051 Prestige as well). I repeat this service about once a year.

1. The legs of the tuning slide will get corrosion and micro scratches over time which increases stiction. (Bad)
2. Disconnect the linkage and remove the slide.
3. I clean (first) then polish the legs of the tuning slide using Wrights Silver creme to make sure all corrosion is gone and they are very smooth. Don't do this on a triggerless horn unless you want the slides to fall out.
4. I clean the receiving ferrules using an old T-shirt and Brass Saver brush. This insures that all old greasy, dirty oil, etc. has been removed.
5. I use Hetman #5 Slide oil on the tuning slide and linkage. I put some on one leg of the slide, then stick the leg in the horn all the way, turning the slide back and forth as I do so that the slide and receiver are well oiled. Do the other leg. Now put the slide in and reconnect the linkage.
6. The slide action should be good and not catch, however it may be somewhat sluggish as Hetman #5 is kind of thick. I then use Hetman #1 valve oil (just a drop or two) to lightly dilute the slide oil until trigger action is perfect. I also use #5 on the ball joints.

I have never used trombone creme on my euphonium triggers because it washes out too quickly. I like Hetman #5 (with or without dilution) because it lasts a long time and is somewhat impervious to washing out.

Any micro-abrasion or dirt that roughens the surfaces between the slide and receiver walls will eventually cause the slide to "catch". Please keep in mind that even the slightest mis-alignment may cause the tuning slide to cock in the receivers and catch. Since my horn has the Besson style belly pan (without Besson's heavy braces), I have to remove and re-install the belly pan carefully so it doesn't misalign the receivers.

Doug

[daruby]

I'm pretty confident it's the slide (not the main tuning slide, but the one attached to the main tuning slide). On another note, my 4th valve is awful noisy. I have Mead springs in all my valves, but the 4th is the only noisy one.

Pick up a new set of felts. Also slightly bend the 4th valve retainer so that the 4th valve is not pushed up hard against the valve cap when you put the horn away. The 4th valve tends to stay wet and sit in oily water. When the retainer holds the 4th valve in tight, it tends to compress the felts and the wet oily gunk causes the finger button felt to stay compressed. In my experience, this causes excessive 4th valve noise on the down stroke. I purchase Besson "soft stop" felts when in England by the gross but you can get them via eBay.

[Jasonium]

Ben,

The issue here with Euphonium triggers is not just lubrication, but also cleanliness and how it is serviced. Here is how I got the trigger on my Sterling to work smooth as silk (did the same to my brand new 2007 Besson 2051 Prestige as well). I repeat this service about once a year.

1. The legs of the tuning slide will get corrosion and micro scratches over time which increases stiction. (Bad)
2. Disconnect the linkage and remove the slide.
3. I clean (first) then polish the legs of the tuning slide using Wrights Silver creme to make sure all corrosion is gone and they are very smooth. Don't do this on a triggerless horn unless you want the slides to fall out.
4. I clean the receiving ferrules using an old T-shirt and Brass Saver brush. This insures that all old greasy, dirty oil, etc. has been removed.
5. I use Hetman #5 Slide oil on the tuning slide and linkage. I put some on one leg of the slide, then stick the leg in the horn all the way, turning the slide back and forth as I do so that the slide and receiver are well oiled. Do the other leg. Now put the slide in and reconnect the linkage.
6. The slide action should be good and not catch, however it may be somewhat sluggish as Hetman #5 is kind of thick. I then use Hetman #1 valve oil (just a drop or two) to lightly dilute the slide oil until trigger action is perfect. I also use #5 on the ball joints.

I have never used trombone creme on my euphonium triggers because it washes out too quickly. I like Hetman #5 (with or without dilution) because it lasts a long time and is somewhat impervious to washing out.

Any micro-abrasion or dirt that roughens the surfaces between the slide and receiver walls will eventually cause the slide to "catch". Please keep in mind that even the slightest mis-alignment may cause the tuning slide to cock in the receivers and catch. Since my horn has the Besson style belly pan (without Besson's heavy braces), I have to remove and re-install the belly pan carefully so it doesn't misalign the receivers.

Doug

Since I got my Yamaha Neo with trigger, I've tried so many things to get the main tuning slide moving smoothly. I've tried Super Slick tuning slide grease, Super Slick trombone cream with and without water, Al Cass, Hetman #3 and Yamaha synthetic valve oils - EVERYTHING STUCK. A Yamaha representative recommended the Yamaha synthetic tuning slide oil. I went with their suggestion since they probably used this oil in their development and testing. The slide no longer stuck but was still sluggish. I just read your 6th bullet point and mixed in some Hetman #3 to the tuning slide oil (maybe 70 to 30 tuning to valve oil ratio). Lo and behold, it's now smooth and quick! Thank you so much!

[Davidus1]

Some tips on servicing your Sterling.

First: I have gotten fantastic results on my 9 year old Sterling's tuning slide trigger mechanism by:

1. Extremely thorough cleaning of the the slide and the receiving tubes the slide goes into. I use hot soapy water to clean the slide and an old t-shirt and Brass-Saver cleaning brush to swab out the tubes.
2. When the horn was new, I used Wright's Silver Cream to polish the legs of the tuning slide to ensure smoother action. This must be done judiciously as you are not trying to "hone" the fit, just get a smoother action.
3. I use Hetman #6 slide oil on the slide and on any pivot points. It doesn't washout easily. I found trombone creme a bit too light after it got wet.

Second: I use standard Besson-style finger button, top cap, and piston felts. The piston and finger button felts are synthetic and are receptive to being washed in hot soapy water and dried out to get rid of accumulated oil and moisture. I change the felts out about once a year. I purchase replacement supplies each year on my trips to England when I am at IBBSS, but they are readily available via eBay as well.

Third: For the fourth valve, it accumulates moisture more than the other three so felt cleaning/replacement is more important. Also, I bend the tab holding the valve in just a bit so that the valve is held slightly off the valve cap, thus not compressing the felts.

I might mention, that all three of the service procedures I describe above were also done on my Besson Prestige and the second two on ALL euphoniums I have owned since my 1980 Sovereign. Also, I use Mead Springs on my Sterling as well.

Excellent suggestions! Thanks for sharing.