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Thread: Mouthpiece advice for a Tuba player

  1. #1

    Mouthpiece advice for a Tuba player 4AL v 52D

    I'm new to this forum so please forgive me if this isn't the ideal place to post this.

    A little background. I'm primarily a tuba player but i started out on trombone and euphonium as a sophomore in High School. I played a bach 6 1/2AL for about 3 months before switching to a Bach 5G. I went to college as a tuba major but I've still played trombone and euphonium in brass ensembles and community bands over the years. I play a Schilke 60 when I play bass trombone and love it. I still play a bach 5G on my small bore trombone and marching baritone but I've recently switched to a Giddings Euros for large bore. (All of my tuba mouthpieces are giddings) The Euros as i understand it is similar to a 5G but with a larger backbore. I love it for my tenor trombone and I've enjoyed it on euphonium but I'm looking for something with more depth.

    Here is where I need advice. I have been trying to do my own research but I'm getting overwhelmed. After reading a lot about the Schilke 51D I thought that might be exactly what I'm looking for. But... then I found a thread where Doug Elliot commented on how it's a smaller rim than the 5G. To those who play a 51D how is it getting into the low register?

    I'm not afraid of large equipment. In fact even messing around with the Schilke 60 on my euphonium it felt great. I loved how great the low register sounded and was still able to comfortably get up to c above middle c. C5? That being said it wasn't the sound I'm looking for in the mid to upper register.

    I won't have the opportunity to sit and play a bunch of mouthpieces and make a truly informed decision. But hopefully you wonderful people could help guide me to two or three mouthpieces that I could whittle down to one that I pull the trigger on.

    TL;DR: I'm looking to switch to a mouthpiece that has more depth to the sound that maybe has a larger rim and deeper cup than a 5G.

    Thanks!
    Last edited by CranstonTuba; 05-19-2018 at 01:42 PM. Reason: Narrowing the question.

  2. #2
    Ok. So hopefully me narrowing my search will solicit responses.

    I'm curious about the Schilke 52D. What are peoples experience with it like? How do people feel about it compared to a DW 4AL.

    The 4AL seems like it might be what I'm looking for but I'd love some feedback.

    Feel free to make other mouthpiece suggestions as well. I'm not a euphonium gear head so I'd love to hear peoples experience and expertise.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    West Palm Beach, FL
    Posts
    3,853
    Welcome to the forum.

    The Wick 4AL is one of the most popular mouthpieces for euphonium. It's larger than the Schilke 51D and has a more 'funnel' shaped cup than the Schilke - which I think gives a better tone. But, everyone's tone preference is different. Schilke 60 would be too large for me but I know of at least one pro (Walter ?) who plays on a Schilke 60. He's also a Yamaha performing artist and doubles on tuba.

    Hope this helps.
    Rick Floyd
    Miraphone 5050 - Warburton BJ / RF mpc
    YEP-641S (recently sold)
    Doug Elliott - 102 rim; I-cup; I-9 shank


    "Always play with a good tone, never louder than lovely, never softer than supported." - author unknown.
    Symphonic Band of the Palm Beaches
    El Cumbanchero (Raphael Hernandez, arr. Naohiro Iwai)
    Chorale and Shaker Dance
    (John Zdechlik)

  4. #4
    I favor the 4AL myself for a good, all-around mouthpiece. But IMHO a 3AL also works, with a slightly less-ringing high range and an easier low range. Any larger than that loses too much center up high and sounds tubby overall to me.

    The concave outer profile of the classic Wick series has what I think is a substantial effect on sound. To me, it opens the sound up and lets it sing. Most other cup has a convex profile, putting more mass around the inner cup. That profile seems to solidify the sound and gives it a tighter center at the cost of a less open sound.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC3)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  5. #5
    Here is a list of mouthpieces that are around the 26mm size, plus/minus 10%

    http://www.dwerden.com/Mouthpieces/t....00&Shank=Bass
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC3)
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

  6. #6
    Thanks for the welcome Rick! And thank you both for the feedback. It sounds like I should go for the 4AL. I don’t think I’d regret having it in my collection even I decide I might need something different in the future.

    Thanks again!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    2,369
    I find the 51D to be too small for my tastes. My "normal" euph mouthpiece is the DE listed below. But if I'm playing more standard genuine euph parts in the high register, I will resort to a Wick 5AL -- which I regard as basically cheating because I don't want to constantly spend the time on maintaining my embouchure to enable playing that high with my DE piece. The 5AL plays well in tune for me, and without the effort that a larger mouthpiece requires.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  8. #8
    Update:

    I’ve purchased a DW 4AL and I’ve been playing it for a couple of days. I love it. I like the sharper edge for articulation and clarity. Because the rim contour is so much sharper than the Giddings Euros that I had been using, it doesnt “feel” any larger on my chops, but the results are exactly what I was looking for. The transition into the low and pedal registers are flawless. My upper register seems to sing more freely and I’m not getting fatigued as quickly. The edge also keeps the pressure off my face which is probably a key factor in reducing fatigue.

    I’m pretty excited. Next step will be playing it in ensemble and listening for blend and balance.

    Thanks for everyone’s feedback!

  9. #9
    Second update. The 4AL was great on the Conn 19i was playing on. I acquired a Wessex festivo at the end of Jun and the 4AL was a little too bright of a sound with that horn. I found myself playing the Giddings Euros because of the darker sound. The downside was pitch flexibility. I found the tendencies of the horn were exaggerated with the Euros. Playing the 4AL I had an easier time lipping any pitch issues in tune. I was looking into getting a larger giddings mouthpiece but decided on getting the 3AL.

    I love it. The low register is great and full the high register comes out easier. I feel like I can get more air through without getting too loud and it allows me to really open up the sound if I want to. I’ll be performing Pictures in the spring and the 3AL makes Bydlo easier, especially switching from my CC tuba.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    2,369
    The 3AL is a good selection if you're shooting for a tenor tuba application.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

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