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Thread: SE Shires Euphonium

  1. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by cochranme View Post
    Couple of ideas here that I’d like to comment on . . .*snip*
    Well said.
    David Bjornstad

    1923 Conn New Wonder 86I, Bach 6 1/2 AL
    2018 Wessex EP100 Dolce, Denis Wick 4ABL
    2013 Jinbao JBEP-1111L, Denis Wick 4AM
    2015 Jinbao JBBR-1240, Denis Wick clone mouthpiece of unknown designation
    Cullman (AL) Community Band (Euph Section Leader)
    Brass Band of Huntsville (2nd Bari)

  2. #72
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Dumfries, VA (Potomac Shores)
    Posts
    282
    Martin... how dare you... kidding. I miss you bro! Glad to hear youíre doing well. We need to figure out a hang soon.

    Martin is right. While equipment does make a difference, it will vary player to player. I find that the 2900/51D/BB1 combination locks you into a specific type of sound, but different players can still sound different even on that setup, as Martin said. The thing is to get what suits what youíre looking for the most. Concessions will still have to be made, as there is no perfect horn or perfect mouthpiece.

    Quote Originally Posted by cochranme View Post
    Couple of ideas here that Iíd like to comment on:

    -The medium shank makes a difference, but not as much as some are making it out to be. I played a 2900 for many years and it is a tank. Itís capable of making as big of a sound as anything else. I had a Hirsbrunner for a while with the interchangeable shanks. When using the same mouthpiece (51d) the difference between medium and large shank was non-existent.

    -Yes, certain brands have a tendency toward certain sound qualities, but itís still very much the player that determines the sound. I played a York for a bit and sounded nothing like Dave Childs on his York. Thomas Ruedi and Steve Mead sound nothing alike using Bessons, Thomas and Adam Frey sounded nothing alike when they were both using Yamahas, Ben Pierce and Demondrae Thurman sound nothing alike on Miraphones. I sound nothing like Fernando Deddos on my Adams. Thereís nothing wrong about saying a certain brand isnít a fit for you. Find what fits you but donít expect an instrument to fix your sound.

    -Ditto for mouthpieces. I play an SM3X and sound nothing like Steve Mead.

    -No person, brand, school, or genre (Brass band, military band, etc.) has a monopoly on what a Euphonium ďshouldĒ sound like. There may have been some truth to this at one point, but weíre way more diverse than that now. Thereís room for multiple interpretations of Euphonium sound and style, and Iím very happy to see it happening. I donít want to speak for Brandon or Hiram, but even within individual bands the sound varies. Getting too locked in to one sound and style of playing can be very limiting. Solid tone, rhythm, and pitch, along with a great ear and the ability to adjust to the section, conductor, and ensemble are more important in my experience than having the ďorthodoxĒ sound.


    Good conversation!

  3. Quote Originally Posted by BrandonJones View Post
    Martin... how dare you... kidding. I miss you bro! Glad to hear youíre doing well. We need to figure out a hang soon.
    I donít have your number anymore, send me an email at mceuph75@gmail.com would love to catch up.
    Martin Cochran
    Adams Performing Artist
    mceuph75@gmail.com

  4. #74
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Dumfries, VA (Potomac Shores)
    Posts
    282
    Done.

  5. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by bbocaner View Post
    Yeah, I often see forum posts where people are talking about huge Wick 3ALs and Warburton Demondrae Thurman model mouthpieces and the like as if they were the only serious approach, when many if not most of the people in the US who are actually making a living playing the euphonium are using 51D or BB1.

    The 2900 can indeed be brighter than instruments after the Besson tradition, but that's not saying they sound small or tinny at all. And there's actually kind of a consistency in the attack and the midrange of the sound that makes them very dark in a manner of speaking as well. Timbres are complex and we can throw around terms like bright and dark, but that's highly oversimplified. It's possible euphonium model A to be both brighter AND darker in different ways than euphonium model B.

    My own personal theory is that the sound comes as much from the fact that they are so heavily built with thick gauge brass and lots of bracing as it does from the fact that it has a medium stem receiver and a half inch less of bell diameter than is typical these days.
    I had a 2900 for a while, and I bought it because it was considered by the people around me to be the gold standard for euphoniums at the time. I can see what the argument would be about it being inflexible...

    What is a really good example of a top-notch, well-respected euphonium that is also very sonically flexible?

  6. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Biz View Post
    … What is a really good example of a top-notch, well-respected euphonium that is also very sonically flexible?
    Well now, that would be an Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, just like mine.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, Wessex EP-100 Dolce Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Wessex TE-360 Bombino Eb Tuba
    Rapid City New Horizons & Municipal Bands (Euphonium)
    Black Hills Symphony Orchestra (Bass Trombone), Powder River Symphony, Gillette, WY (Tenor Trombone)
    Black Hills Brass Quintet (Tuba)

  7. #77
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Hidden Valley, AZ
    Posts
    648
    Interesting take on this.

    Playing a 'sonically flexible' euph is like driving a McClaren formula car: One had better be up to it.

    I'll stick to my 'Mack truck' New Standard for now.

    DG
    3 notes and the truth.

    1966 Besson 181 highly modified New Standard, early model Wick 4AL
    1918 Hawkes & Son euph 3&1 original
    1917 Conn C/D/Eb mellophone original
    1915 York Bb tenorhorn original, Bach 5GS

  8. #78
    Maybe I'm dense or partially deaf, but I've never heard anything that I would consider "sonically flexible"from a euphonium. I've listened to a good many players over the years playing on different horns, and sure they have different sounds, but they generally maintain the same timbre whether playing loud soft, etc. I've never heard a euphonium sound gain intensity and the just open like what can achieved on a cello or have a great deal of variability between a brighter and darker sound. That is, each horn seems to have its sound and it stays within that sound with a small degree of variability. So, maybe someone could point out a good example of a euphonium being played in a "sonically flexible" manner. I would love to hear it.

    Mike

  9. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by mbrooke View Post
    Maybe I'm dense or partially deaf, but I've never heard anything that I would consider "sonically flexible"from a euphonium. I've listened to a good many players over the years playing on different horns, and sure they have different sounds, but they generally maintain the same timbre whether playing loud soft, etc. I've never heard a euphonium sound gain intensity and the just open like what can achieved on a cello or have a great deal of variability between a brighter and darker sound. That is, each horn seems to have its sound and it stays within that sound with a small degree of variability. So, maybe someone could point out a good example of a euphonium being played in a "sonically flexible" manner. I would love to hear it.

    Mike
    Mike - I tend to agree with you. I am not even quite sure what sonically flexible is in relating to a euphonium sound. My response above was tongue in cheek. My horn and mouthpiece and me together make a certain sound on my Adams. I like it. I can probably shade the tone or sound somewhat. I can also make it brighter or darker with different mouthpieces. But the overall sound of this combination of horn, mouthpiece and me stays pretty much consistent.

    There are some folks who say they can make their horn sound like "this" for classical playing and sound like "this" for jazzier playing and maybe sound like "this" for something in between that. I would say that unless you are changing equipment, the horn will sound pretty much the same for all varieties of music you play. What is different is your air, your phrasing, your articulations, your vibrato or not, your dynamics, your rhythm, your sense of style, your tonguing, your interpretation, etc. By making changes to some or all of these things, you can perhaps sound a little different, but the underlying sound you make with your horn and equipment I think remains pretty constant.
    John Morgan
    The U.S. Army Band (Pershing's Own) 1971-1976
    Adams E3 Custom Series Euphonium, Wessex EP-100 Dolce Euphonium, 1956 B&H Imperial Euphonium
    Adams TB1 Tenor Trombone, Yamaha YBL-822G Bass Trombone
    Wessex TE-360 Bombino Eb Tuba
    Rapid City New Horizons & Municipal Bands (Euphonium)
    Black Hills Symphony Orchestra (Bass Trombone), Powder River Symphony, Gillette, WY (Tenor Trombone)
    Black Hills Brass Quintet (Tuba)

  10. #80
    Maybe being "sonically flexible" means something like I read from jazz cornetist, Warren Vache. He plays a longer style cornet-- the kind that resembles an Olds Ambassdor, etc that was standard for beginning cornetists when I grew up-- not the short model used in British brass bands. Yet I read him claiming that if he played a shallower mouthpiece and tuned his horn slightly sharp, he could play lead trumpet in any big band on his horn.

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