generally, what range is expected from the euphonium in community band type music?

[mbrown]

i am a tuba player masquerading as a euphoniumist... i'm having a LOT of fun learning to play it though. especially the marches where i double the trumpet parts or high wood wind parts.

right now the G above the staff is the highest i have, so i've been practicing up to the next Bb to make sure i'm able to play the G when i need to. i don't have any problem with low register, of course...

i'm curious what is normally expected for a euphonium player?

[John Morgan]

About 4 octaves above where you are now. (Pause) Okay, just kidding. Sort of depends. Pros and really good players will probably want to and be able to go almost an octave above the 3rd ledger line G concert. The high F above high concert Bb comes to mind. Not everyone can play up to that note, and for those that can play that note, not everyone can play it well. So you are in very good company if you can play perhaps only up to the high concert Bb or a little beyond. I would say if you could play the high C or Db above high concert Bb, that should just about cover you for most any concert band literature, even the more difficult grades/pieces. And for many, many euphonium solos. And for those euphonium solos that have really high notes, many times there are alternative lower notes for those not wanting or able to play extremely high.

The best parts of playing marches on euphonium, in my opinion, are usually when the euphonium has counter melodies. Or the melody (ALONE!!!!!) in the trios without some infernal trumpet or clarinet player playing along. Doubling the trumpets or other non-brass instruments is not the most fun part for me, in case you couldn't tell, but as you are learning the euphonium, that might be really useful now.

Good luck in your euphonium playing. Be careful, the euphonium is addicting, and your tuba may start getting dusty!!

[mbrown]

uh oh... that's a little higher than i was thinking, but maybe i'll get there... that's about where i am on tuba... i'm pretty solid up to the F above the staff and can get to the next Bb if i need to, but it may not sound as good as it should. i can squeak out higher pitches with a little embouchure manipulation.

if we get to play more tunes like this, i'll be excited about euphonium. i've been somewhat bored with the community bands (i play in 3) music level so far. i have lots of fun visiting with the other tubas in the bands (some us are in all 3) and we have a little quartet that plays at the concerts once in a while. and there's a quintet that does a few gigs like weddings once in a while... so i'm very happy to see something a little more challenging.

i've been working out of an old arban tuba book that has the Eb tuba part written in. that has helped and i have a copy of the melodious etude trombone book.

i do an hour on euphonium, rest for abt 15 minutes and then do an hour on tuba. playing euphonium has helped my tuba, firming up the embouchure corners and with articulation. there's not room for sloppiness in the euphonium that i've been getting away with on the tuba.

i started out on an old holton 185 3 valve horn built somewhere in the 50's. it looks like its been in a train wreck but it plays very well. i went to a little conn short stemmed 20I, that i liked, but i couldn't produce the sound i had in my head. i bought a king 2280 with a larger bore and bigger mouthpiece and i'm getting closer to what i want to hear. i'd rather have a front action so i'm saving my $ for one of the wessex front action euphs. but i may get used to top action and stay with what i have.

i'm also thinking that i'm quickly getting to the age where lugging around 50 lbs of tuba ( i weighed my king 2431 in the case... it was about 50 lbs) will get difficult, so the euphonium is an alternative... and in the bands i'm in, there's always a chair for another euphonium... there seems to be lots of tubas, but not many REAL euphoniums.

[davewerden]

If you just want to enjoy playing in a concert band, it's not quite so bad. Much of the repertoire will be happy if you have a concert G, BUT many marches, including Stars & Stripes Forever, have a Bb. That appears twice in the breakup strain. I think Hands Across the Sea also would like a Bb, but it is only a single note. As John said, though, you can get by taking a lick down an octave now & then. If you don't have a high Bb, I'm betting most bands would still be more than happy to have you join if you play solidly otherwise (and maybe even if not!).

[JasonDonnelly]

Most pieces in the "community band" repertoire will not go below F2 (just below the bass clef staff) or above Ab4 (three ledger lines above bass clef staff). As Dave mentioned, some marches will go up to the Bb above that, but in most (if not all) cases, you could bring that down an octave if needed.

Just for fun, the highest and lowest notes I have encountered in the band euphonium rep are an Eb5 in Kevin Houben's "The Lost Labyrinth" and a Bb1 (pedal Bb) in Grainger's "Children's March".

[iiipopes]

Most pieces in the "community band" repertoire will not go below F2 (just below the bass clef staff) or above Ab4 (three ledger lines above bass clef staff). As Dave mentioned, some marches will go up to the Bb above that, but in most (if not all) cases, you could bring that down an octave if needed.

Just for fun, the highest and lowest notes I have encountered in the band euphonium rep are an Eb5 in Kevin Houben's "The Lost Labyrinth" and a Bb1 (pedal Bb) in Grainger's "Children's March".

As another tuba player "masquerading" as a euph player, I concur: generally F below the staff to Ab three ledger lines and a space above the staff. Famously, "Stars and Stripes Forever," which we play every Independence day for the regional community observances, has both: the F below the staff in the first strain, and goes up to the Bb 4 ledger lines above the staff in the dogfight (or, in transposed treble clef notation for those who play such, written G below the treble clef to written Bb or C above the treble clef). And yes, if it is at the end of a long outdoor concert, I will take that high Bb down an octave, as well as the F below the staff up an octave in order to center the next phrase properly.

[RickF]

A lot of bands play Holst Suite no. 2 in 'F' which gets down to low concert 'C' (4-1-3) and lots of low 'F's (4). We're playing this great piece for our first concert series. Some great euphonium solos for sure. Since it's public domain you can look at your part here:
Scroll down to pg 31 for euphonium part

[davewerden]

A lot of bands play Holst Suite no. 2 in 'F' which gets down to low concert 'C' (4-1-3) and lots of low 'F's (4).

Thanks, Rick. I'd forgotten those notes (it's been a while)! However, it is only a few bars, and those double the tubas, so playing up an octave would be fine. But now I have to remember that one for future discussions about range, because it is certainly a staple of the repertoire.

[mbrown]

thanks for the parts... i've played the tuba part to S&SF and holst several times. i've never seen the S&SF euph part. i should practice that, i'm sure i'll run into it before long. a lot of the holst is in the tuba part...

i'm pretty confident up to Bb above middle C and i'm ok in the low register, just not much flexibility down there yet. my lips feel like they're sticking to the inside of the mouthpiece, but i'm practicing out of an old arban tuba book that has an Eb and BBb part written. i do both octaves...

[adrian_quince]

A lot of bands play Holst Suite no. 2 in 'F' which gets down to low concert 'C' (4-1-3) and lots of low 'F's (4).

On more than one occasion, I've wondered if someone at Boosey & Hawkes either nudged Holst into writing those notes or simply added them to the printed version to spur sales of their compensating euphoniums. Holst, by and large, was a very careful orchestrator who tended not to push instruments into extreme ranges. But in both the Second Suite and the two movements of the Planets put out by Boosey for band, there are notes only playable on a 4-valve euphonium.

[ChristianeSparkle]

Apologies for the revival of this old thread. I've always been confused by the range I'm supposed to have on the Euphonium. From the posts here, it seems like the Bb 4 ledger lines above the bass clef staff is the usual range and adequate for most community repertoire. I've found the chart above that says anything above that is considered extended. It is safe to say that we are generally unlikely to see such ranges in community band repertoires, right?

I've always heard high school students saying they can hit C5 or E5 , which sounds like the extended range notes. Never seen repertoire that high and after 15 years of playing, I can only hit Bb 4 ledger lines above and that's even pushing it

[RickF]

For community band normal repertoire you’re mostly correct. I sometimes see the high B natural (4 ledger lines above) bass clef staff. That note is notoriously difficult for many model euphs but I’m lucky to play the M5050 where it’s easily played fingered 2 OR 1-2. Holst 1st Suite you have notes lower than the normal range in the chart where you need at least a 4-valve horn.

[John Morgan]

My thinking on range for community band players is that a high Bb is pretty adequate and a low F is pretty adequate, which allows those that don't have 4 valve instruments the opportunity to play about 99+% of notes you might see. However, if you have a four valve instrument, I would learn how to play from F (or E natural) down to pedal Bb. You don't encounter very many notes in that range, but it is just fun and useful at times to be able to do that. As for the high range, my philosophy on that has always been like this:

What is the note that you feel you must be able to play? Is it a high Bb? Or perhaps a high C? Whatever the note is, then that WOULD NOT be the note that I have in my repertoire as the absolute highest note I can play. Let me explain. The high Bb in Stars and Stripes comes to mind. If that is the very highest note you can play, then often you would miss it, or if you hit it, it might sound strained. So, therefore, I would always try to have a couple or three notes (chromatically) above my target highest note that I could play at least a little bit decent. If you are able to play a trifle above your target highest pitch, then you are more likely to have a good high target highest note.

[ChristianeSparkle]

Thank you, Mr. Floyd & Mr. Morgan!

And that philosophy makes a lot of sense and definitely is helpful! Learning to play a few chromatic notes higher than the required note so that you can play that note well. I am seeing a lot of Bb (4 ledger lines above) in our repertoire lately, and I've definitely been having a hard time consistently hit them. Will try to apply that philosophy!

It feels as if I strain my lips and my face even when playing the A and Bb, so it's even worse for anything above. I am guessing it's still down to strengthening my lips and outputting faster air to slowly build up those B natural and C above the Bb4 ?

[John Morgan]

...It feels as if I strain my lips and my face even when playing the A and Bb, so it's even worse for anything above. I am guessing it's still down to strengthening my lips and outputting faster air to slowly build up those B natural and C above the Bb4 ?

One of the best ways to improve range (and become/stay proficient on scales) is to play scales starting low, then go up a half step each time, until you are playing up to and above high Bb. Start the scale soft and end it loud. Try to hold the last note for a while. Play a pedal tone or two in between scales. Repeat.

As a usual part of my warmups (when I have 30 minutes or so) I start on low Bb (in the staff) and play a one octave Bb concert scale. Then a one octave B natural scale. Then a one octave C scale. Ending up with a one octave scale starting on tuning note Bb up to high Bb. I do this daily. It gets all the major scales and two octaves worth of range. I sometimes will then start on tuning note Bb and play one octave down. Do this until I play down to the pedal Bb. That gets all the scales again, only lower, now I have three full octaves. Then I might start on tuning Bb and go up an octave until I play maybe Eb up to high Eb above high Bb. Or maybe only C to C, or Db to Db, but at least some scales that go above high Bb. These really help me with both range, and facility will all major scales so that they are second nature to me. And I always throw in some arpeggios sort of just like the scale work, but up and down with the arpeggios. A long time ago, when I practiced scales, I got in the habit of not only playing scales to become familiar with them, but I tried to make playing scales sound musical. So I most always vary tempo, articulations, dynamics, vibrato, etc. so that a scale can sound beautiful. My philosophy here is never waste a scale by just playing the notes, make music with it, improvise, vary things, always keep it interesting. This makes learning how to play high just sort of happen as a result of doing other things.