Help me decide!

[Dmom]

Hi everyone! I'm excited to have found this forum! My kid is in middle school and this is her first year playing the euphonium. She really loves it and will play at least another year and possibly into high school. She plays a 3 valve euphonium at school and we've been renting her home instrument and already have spent half of what an entry level one will cost so we're looking to purchase a used euphonium and found two options.

Jupiter JEP-468 vs. Yamaha YEP-201.

From what I can gather, these two are pretty similar in functionality. The Yamaha is made in Japan, I don't know where Jupiter is made from. Any thoughts on which is preferred both in terms of sound and resale value (if any?) I don't play so I'm clueless, any help would be greatly appreciated!

[John Morgan]

What is your budget / price range? You can purchase a brand new Wessex Dolce (imported from China) 4-valve compensating (a very good feature, especially if your daughter continues to play) horn for about $1,100. I own one, and it is outstanding at that price point, and pretty darn good at any price point. If she chose not to continue after a couple years, you probably would have little difficulty getting much of what you spent back if you decided to sell it. Look in this category for my review of the Wessex done around January 2016.

[Dmom]

Hi, thank you for your quick response. I never considered Wessex as it doesn't come up on searches much (I spent all of one day), but I will definitely look into that. I would like to spend less tho and that's why I was looking at used instruments but I'm finding that these are sort of hard to find. How different is it playing 3-value vs. 4? She plays a 3-valve at school and if she had a 4-valve at home, would that cause her problems?

[davewerden]

If she is in junior high any may not continue for more than a couple years, I would not necessarily go with the Wessex. It will be heavier and require more air. In its favor: if she takes care of it she can keep it through college if it turns out to be an option.

A 3-valve euphonium is lighter and usually not as large (less air required). Unfortunately, it is hard to find a decent one for much less than a new Wessex! I'll keep my eyes open, though.

Another option is the Jean Baptiste, which can be bought new for about $700:

http://www.amazon.com/Jean-Baptiste-.../dp/B005HGTFXU

Only 2 reviews, but they are not bad. The flat note mentioned in the first review is not unusual on many horns. And the sticky valves the other review mentions is probably due to not breaking them in properly. There are several threads on this forum addressing that.

Here is a used Jupiter for a decent price ($700 to buy it now, or you can make a lower offer):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jupiter-Carn...-/162066722477

If a bell-front horn does carry a stigma in this band, here is a nice vintage Pam American (like Conn) for $400:

http://www.dwerden.com/forum/showthr...l-Front-Silver

These are typically very nice horns and well-suited for a school environment.

[davewerden]

Oh, and playing a 4-valve horn is no harder (but it adds a little weight). A 4-valve compensating horn like the Wessex is a larger bore (more air), but that is not because of the 4th valve.

On a 3-valve horn a couple low notes are sharp: the ones played with 13 and 123 (they don't come up often, but they do come up). A 4-valve horn can make those in tune with fingerings 4 and 24 respectively. However, they can still be played like a 3-valve horn. The 4th also allows you to play lower, but that is not generally needed until at least high school, and even then it's only in a very few band pieces.

If the player is small-framed, I worry about jumping to a 4-valve compensating horn too early. But for students who are larger or very fit, the larger horns work out fine.

[daviste]

At our high school we have quite a few Gerhard Baier instruments. One tuba, one three valve euph, and I believe our four marching baritones are Gerhard Baier instruments, too. The three valve euph is the one our section leader (next year's drum major if I might add) is using. And she loves that thing.

[Dmom]

Ok, so you would recommend a new Jean Baptiste over used Jupiter 468 (found one for $400) or Yamaha 201 (priced used around $700-$900)?

She's currently using w. Nirschl at home on rental. I just want something that she can have fun playing for the next few years and then I can turn around and sell it towards a better instrument if/when her ability improves. Thank you so much for all your help everyone!

[cognitofalcon]

I personally think the Jupiter is the best 3 valve student horn on the market. From my personal experience, the Jupiter 468 fofr that price point would be my recommendation if it isn't that old. I have had the chance to play one and was very surprised at how nicely it played and sounded. Right now I would go with the Jupiter. The price is right if the condition is fair. Also make sure she has a decent mouthpiece to use as well. I would recommend at least a 6 1/2 AL. No smaller.

[Jasmine]

Hello,
I'm 13 and I'm playing on the Wessex Dolce (including the Wessex mouthpiece with and now without my teeth braces) for a couple of month now. It wasn't so difficult. I still have to work my breath but I think I'll keep this instrument for years !

[jimpjorps]

There's a couple used Dillon euphoniums (similar manufacture to the Wessex instruments) in their store right now -- a 4-valve one for $545 and a 3+1 (three valves on top, one on the side; a little more comfortable for smaller hands or people with weak pinkies) for $795.

[bbocaner]

A middle school player is absolutely ready for four valves. A really excellent middle school player could be ready for a large compensating instrument.

[davewerden]

If you want to go to a 4-valve compensating horn, here is Jean Baptiste model in silver. Seems to be in really good shape. The case has wheels, which might come in handy. The silver could use a good polishing, but I'll bet your student would be glad to do that!

It is $800 (the buy-it-now price):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jean-Baptist...-/252403617099

[daniel76309]

Another option I have not seen mentioned is an older used Besson 3-valve compensating, like this:

http://www.dwerden.com/forum/showthr...h#.V0gu0t_2Zg4

The down-side is an older horn like this would likely require a good cleaning and possibly a few other things, but these horns have a beautiful sound, are built like tanks--and if she is only going to play a few years, it is likely that you can resell for same or more when the time comes. I think resale value on economy intro-level horns probably is not nearly as good.

[Dmom]

Her teacher said she should get a 4 valve compensating one so I'm now looking at those. She says Yamaha is best generally but they are sooo expensive. This Jean Baptiste looks good and so does the Wessex Dolce. I would prefer to not look at something too old because I wouldn't even know what needs to be done to it or even where to take it to. Since the price difference is not too large, I wonder if it's better to get the Wessex? She also said she would want her switch to a 12C mouthpiece soon? I assume these are all interchangeable??

[davewerden]

If you are thinking "compensating" then I'd go with the Wessex. It is a fine choice.

A 12C is very small cup for a compensating horn, though. The Wessex (and most compensating horns) use a large shank mouthpiece (bass-trombone sized shank), and I don't think there is a large-shank version with the 12C cup.

A 6-1/2AL is a standard starter mouthpiece for a horn like this, and that can be had with a large shank. Here is a chart showing the sizes you can probably find in large shank:

http://www.dwerden.com/Mouthpieces/t...-euphonium.cfm