embouchure problem

[redsplus]

Hi,
I play the euphonium with a schilke 51D, and I notice that a ring forms around my lips every single time I play. I have tried everything that my teacher has told me, yet nothing seems to fix the problem. I have also tested myself with different amounts of pressure, and for me, it simply does not matter. I am sure that it is my embouchure and not the mouthpiece, but I noticed that the inside rim of the mouthpiece is very "squared" and not round. I have played on a wick heritage and the problem did not occur. I appreciate any advice that anyone may have.

Thanks

[Jrpetty24]

From my experience, whenever I play and whatever I play on, I always get a ring, but that is just simply because you are putting some amount of pressure on your lips to create the buzz. If you put too much pressure the ring will form fast and render your lips ineffective or tired after a short period of time because of lack of circulation, but even when using a "proper" amount of pressure the ring will form eventually because of fatigue and then the natural tendency will be to assert more pressure to compensate for the lack of muscles staying firm(not tense). Some pieces will creat the circle faster, these are typically narrow rims and or sharper rim edges, like the squareness you mentioned, where as wider and flatter rims will take longer to form the circle because of a greater surface area to spread out the pressure.

Like I said above the narrower sharper rims, like the 51D, wll fatigue and create the circle faster, whereas the wider flatter rims as well as some of the rounder rims like ther heritage you mentioned, will fatigue less quickly and create the circle slower.

Now that I have talked a whole bunch of jumbo, do you have any playing issues that you think are associated with this? What things have you done to reduce mouthpiece pressure?

[redsplus]

Thanks for the response!
To answer your question, I don't think there aren't any playing issues that are associated with this, besides the fact that my embouchure gets tired easily. And to reduce mouthpiece pressure, I have been working on my embouchure strength by practicing playing in the high range with as little pressure as possible.

I know that endurance is mostly the player and not the mouthpiece, but are there any mouthpieces that you recommend that will help?

[Jrpetty24]

Great, I'm glad you aren't having any issues! One thing that I do to keep myself from putting to much pressure is when I buzz, pull the rim so its just touching your lips enough to get a seal on the rim and then do any of your regular mouthpiece buzzing this way. This can be transferred to the horn by slightly pulling of the face when playing, again make sure you still get a seal, you may get a slightly airy sound until you find the sweet spot between too much pressure and not enough.

As far as mouthpieces go I've learned that everyone's face plays better with different shapes of rims, and mine works with the narrow rim. So I had to just be patient and work on using less pressure. But going solely based off of what you are looking for, a heritage or standard wick may be the way to go. Try a 5AL which has a slightly wider rim diameter but has a thicker rim surface.

What model of the heritage did you play on? If you liked the sound and it was comfortable, why not get one? I prefer a larger rim diameter for myself, and when I tried the Heritage 4AL I liked it, but not the exact sound I wanted.

Like you said, endurance is mainly a player thing, mouthpieces with a thicker rim surface, not necessarily a wider rim diameter, will give better endurance, but you really need to find out what sounds best on you face and work with it. Many people do use the Wicks with a thicker rim very successfully, but it wasn't for me. So try a couple pieces and find what is the best compromise of comfort and sound and then do the rest of the work yourself

[davewerden]

First, the 51D is not a great high-range mouthpiece. That be a small factor here.

Even lead trumpet players don't spend all their time practicing in that playing range. Most good brass teachers would recommend widening your range in both directions. Spend good time each session to work on low range, too. A 4-valve euphonium can go to the bottom C on the piano. Work toward that. I would say not to spend too long a time in the high range in one stretch. Spend a few minutes up there, then go down low for a while, then play some lip slurs and/or nice melodies in the middle. Then go back up again. Ideally you want (and need!) to be able to move between ranges easily.

[redsplus]

Thanks I will work on using your technique to find the sweet spot

and I believe I played on the 4AL

[redsplus]

Thanks Dave! My teacher has advised me to work on my low range as well as my high range, and so far, I can consistently play the pedal D (the one below the pedal Bb)
I will keep working on my range as well as the lip slurs that you mentioned
I will also try a few other mouthpieces to find one that suits me better than the 51D