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Thread: Chinese bass trombones

  1. #11
    Re-guarding hand braces - they help immensely. Especially the bullet brace. I played bass trombone for over 10 years and always used one. Especially with the dual trigger.

    If you are looking for a ergonomic small bass check out the King 5B. It has a space by the brace that you can stick your thumb through. Bach 50Bs are good. I had a Bach 50B3 and a Holton-TR-181 and enjoyed both. I had a King 4B+ as a tenor. All played well. I even played some bass on the 4B. I had to stop due to a right elbow issue.

    Also if you are going single trigger make sure you have a enough tuning slide to pull it to E so that you can hit the low B.

    Talk to DJ Kennedy in the Trombone forum. He can hook you up.
    Rodgeman
    Mirafone 186 Recording Bell BBb

  2. Shameless plug here:

    www.ebay.com/itm/231557235011

    Gary, I have another bass that I've similarly modified and will be offering for sale soon...that other one is based off the King 7B, whereas this ebay auction is for a Yamaha 830 clone. That other horn also has the Shires leadpipe, and has an even better hand brace, the Edwards bullet brace. I have not taken any photos of that yet. If interested, we should talk off line....I'd love nothing better than to avoid ebay all together. Email is msfurness@hotmail.com
    Last edited by euphdude; 05-15-2015 at 08:46 AM.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    1,990
    Thanks. I've rethought my trombone lust and am now reconsidering. It would be neat to have one, but I don't spend as much time now as I should playing the euph (since most time is spent with the tubas). So I'm now inclined to not acquiring an instrument I won't use.

    In the interim, however -- and after a lot of searching and hand-wringing -- I had finally kind of focused on a single-rotor bass that's offered by Laabs and appears to be a clone of the Yamaha 421G (minus G). My feeling is that I would play something like this more -- and enjoy it more -- than a double-valve horn. And it's quite inexpensive (though oddly a bit pricier than their two-rotor horns in some cases).

    No one else seems to offer this model (http://www.jimlaabsmusic.com/band-or.../prod_442.html).

    But now I have to re-convince myself that if I got a trombone it wouldn't just sit in its case 90% of the time.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (Denis Wick 3XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba, modified Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K9/112 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  4. #14
    If you go this a single valve bass you will probably need one with a E pull on the F attachment. Without it you will have difficult with the low B natural.
    Rodgeman
    Mirafone 186 Recording Bell BBb

  5. #15
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Oklahoma City
    Posts
    263
    Wessex offers that horn too I believe. They're website is out of date and they have 3 bass trombones. I contacted Wessex about a week ago and Chip Hoehler responded with some info.

    We have 3 Bass Trbns. One is a clone of the King 7B and another one is very much like the Yamaha Xeno. Those 2 are 2 rotary valve independent Bass Trbns. We also have a single valve bass (Bb/F) that is a cross between a Bach and a King, with a Bach style trigger and a 9-1/2 inch King bell flare. All of our Bass Trbns have rose brass bells and nickel-silver slides.

    The changes seem to be the bell material as most Jin-Bao trombones I have seen are yellow brass. I'm sure there are many more changes. The prices for all three horns are the same as the King Clone listed on the Wessex site.

    I'd also look at the Mack Brass bass, it's about the same price as the Schiller single trigger.
    Last edited by Msan1313; 05-15-2015 at 10:37 AM.

  6. Totally fine Gary. When I post my 7B clone with Shires leadpipe and Edwards Bullet brace for sale, I will check back here to see if you are still interested. There is no way I'll be asking anywhere near what Jim Laabs is charging. Get a double valve horn with Shires leadpipe and Edwards hand brace for at least $130 less than the single valve Schiller.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Leadwood, MO
    Posts
    527
    Gary,Where did you land on this? I just put a deposit on a Mack Brass Bass TBone. I have been very very happy with both the Tuba and Euphonium that I purchased so I'm confident the BassBone will be equally of good quality.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    1,990
    I'm not looking at a single-rotor horn on the basis of price, but rather in terms of ergonomics (to some degree), other features (I like the 10" bell), and because I just don't think that for my purposes I'd need the double trigger more than once or twice a year (if that). In addition, my feeling is that if/when I encounter a demand for a fully in-tune low B-natural, it should be playable on the single-rotor horn even if this means I'd need to modify it in some way (which I believe would not be difficult on something like a 421 horn or clone).

    I'm sure that several of these double-valve Chinese bass trombones are excellent (and in fact had the opportunity to play a Mack Brass one for a few minutes). But I do like the larger bell on the 421 clone (my Holton had that size bell), and just don't see the point of having an extra valve ALL of the time for the rare occasions on which you need to play ONE particular note. I'm encouraged in this somewhat deviant perspective by some remarks of Doug Yeo ("a single valve bass trombone works well in almost all symphonic playing situations" -- http://www.yeodoug.com/resources/faq...xt/valves.html), and that my playing would be confined to third and bass trombone parts in community band and smaller groups, and probably on an episodic basis. For those purposes, a large bore tenor (like the Mack Brass) would not be an unreasonable compromise. But I would prefer the larger bore and larger bell.

    Perhaps my ideal choice would be a Yamaha-822G, but I sense that this is not going to happen.

    This will likely turn out to be an "impulse decision" when I end up actually having the discretionary money in hand.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (Denis Wick 3XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba, modified Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K9/112 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  9. The Yamaha 822G is one heck of a horn! That's my bass that I'm not selling. And the Yamaha Doug Yeo mouthpiece that comes with it is fantastic. I had a Doug Elliott made that just sold on ebay that was an easier to play version of that.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    1,990
    As you can see in another thread in this forum, my final choice was to go "low end" and buy the Schiller "American Heritage" clone of the King 7B.

    Over a few months, I made the following changes and acquisitions:


    1. Added an Edwards Bullet Brace. It took a surprising amount of time for me to adjust this so it's comfortable, and this also required adding a wine cork over the thumb support bar. But I'm VERY comfortable with the horn now.
    2. Had the lead pipe pulled and replaced it with a Brass Ark press fit BH62 brass lead pipe. Huge difference.
    3. After MUCH experimentation, settled on a Rath B1.5W mouthpiece. For me at least, this is vastly superior to all the others I tried on this horn.


    Since I would have acquired a Bullet Brace and mouthpiece for ANY horn I bought, these things don't distinguish what I needed to do to the Schiller horn from other possible purchases. I might also have wanted to go with a different lead pipe as well.

    In any event, for $1,000 or less I have ended up with a double valve (independent) bass trombone that I'm very happy with. The fit and finish on it is excellent, and the slide is great. A very close examination will indicate that it's not entirely of the same quality as something like a Bach or Yamaha (or of course, Edwards, Rath, etc.) -- but that's mostly in the area of the absolute precision of the tube extrusions, takes a pretty good eye to notice, and has no effect on performance. And recent reports indicate that contemporary Conn and King products are suffering from the same issues.

    I've thought a bit (encouraged by my wife!) about replacing the horn some time next year when I get reasonably good at trombone. But honestly, I don't see any point to that now. I really like the horn, I'm comfortable with it, it has no problems, and the sound is great.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (Denis Wick 3XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba, modified Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K9/112 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

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