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Thread: Practical tips / "how to" re-lacquer a brass instrument

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Langley, B.C., Canada
    Posts
    7

    Practical tips / "how to" re-lacquer a brass instrument

    Hi,

    I have a Besson Tuba (built in 1959) and probably 40% of the original lacquer has worn off. The raw un-lacquered brass areas were very tarnished / discoloured & "ugly" imho ... I purchased a couple cans of Brasso ... and armed with old toothbrushes, slowly began re-polishing the Tuba.

    I've never done this before, so I'm looking for tips / advice to make the end product of my many hours of prep work ... "pay off " !!

    Questions:

    (1) how did you strip old lacquer off your horn ?
    (2) what products / techniques did you use to polish the brass to a high shine before applying the new clear coat of lacquer ?
    (3) what products / techniques did you use to spray on a clear coat to protect the polished brass ?
    Besson "bell-front" / recording bell Tuba (1959)
    Holton fiberglass Sousaphone (1966)

  2. #2
    Hi dgmatheson,

    My advice as a repairer is that if you do not know how to do this, it's not adviseable to try as it is unlikely to give a good finish unless you are experienced. To get a good finish, you really need to remove any dents that are present as the finishing stage will just highlight inperfections in the surfacing.

    Anyway, enough of the negatives and on to your questions:

    (1) I use nitromors (paint stripper) to remove lacquer from small areas to work on. You could do a whole instrument but it would take a long time and you may need to go over certain areas more than once. If you can find a local stove lacquers, they usually have a chemical tank in which they dip the instrument that will do the job making your life easy and if they're anything like the guys I use here in the U.K. the cost is very reasonable.
    (2) Polishing really takes some experiance to get a good finish, you will need a polishing wheel and then to work though different compounds a mops untill your have a mirror finish. When working with previously finished intruments, I would use tripoli compound around repaired dents and then rouge to bring it to a final shine. There are plenty of guides on which mops to use but I have found that certain areas require 'going against the grain' of mops and changing to something softer/ tougher.
    (3) Lacquering is something I don't have much experience with as I always outsource this to a specialist stove lacquering company, partly because I lack the space/ equipment to lacquer and partly because I have no experience in spraying so without spending many hours, days, weeks etc. learning, it is likely that it would end up streaky with dribbles all over. I know from talking with my guys that if you spray in a dirty dusty environment, you end up finding dust under that lacquer which ruins the finish.

    I hope this gives you an overview in what is envolved.

    Kind regards,
    Philippe L'olive
    www.plbrassrepair.co.uk

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    2,369
    Get the old finish off. Remove what dents you can (ball and magnet method works very well except for dent's in the smaller tubes, knuckles, etc.). Polish raw brass by hand to the degree that you can. Leave it as raw brass.

    You will NOT like the result you get by lacquering it unless (as recommended) you remove ALL the dents and then buff it. If you don't have the experience buffing instruments, you will almost certainly ruin it at that stage. If you're committed to doing it yourself, just strip the finish, polish to your level of ability, and leave it raw brass.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

  4. I concur with Gary, and will make a few more suggestions for the polishing stage.

    1. Polishes such as Brasso or Simichrome can get you a pretty shiny finish, albeit that it begins to dull in a matter of days.
    It is helpful to degrease the horn afterwards as is with Brasso, the base for the solution is an oil, which leaves a residue on the horn.
    A warm dishwater solution and a clean rinse usually works.

    2. A nice brushed finish can be achieved by using a very fine (0000) steel wool along with the Brasso. Try to move the polishing in the direction you think is most pleasing as it will leave very fine brush marks. This type of finish looks clean but is more 'matte' in appearance and seems to dull a bit slower and also seems to show finger prints and smudges a little less.

    3. A bit more dramatic than the steel wool is to use a 'Scotch Brite' pad. This will leave a brushed finish also, but will appear much more pronounced. It is actually offered these days from certain makers. There is also a burnishing brush for electric drills, which has very fine brass wire bristles. I used that once on tuba slides with very nice results. I was not patient enough to try it on large areas. Though it sounds aggressive, it really is not, and theoretically at least, burnishing is not suppose to remove metal but really just brighten the surface by friction. I'm not sure where I got it. Perhaps a local tool shop.

    4. I suppose if you have access to someone who can do 'bead blasting' (AKA - sand blasting - these days done with extremely fine glass beads - such as done on old cars to remove rust) you could achieve a 'satin' finish on the brass. Very 'chic'. This is also offered as a factory finish on some custom horns with a lacquer over it . It is also the base finish under which silver is applied to give the traditional 'frosted' or 'satin silver' look. Areas that you would like in a bright finish should be masked.

    5. Perhaps even "Brillo" would work as would "Bon Ami" (An old friend with a satin finished York from 1926 used Bon Ami for over 50 years and always had a nice clean finish and no wearing through to the brass.)

    So there you have some alternatives.

    There are also metal coloring solutions for adding a patina or browning to the finish, (similar to gun barrel bluing) but I really know nothing about that. Perhaps someone else might chime in.
    BMB F tuba 445s
    BMB CC (BAT) 865s
    Mack Euphonium 1150s
    Wessex F Cimbasso

  5. #5
    It's possible to get a nice reflection in brass by just stopping up grits of the sandpaper (all the way to 2000) and then following that up with mother's metal polish, and then maybe mothers billit polish if you are really obsessed about it


    Here's a thread with more information and photos

    http://forums.chisham.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=54486
    Last edited by 58mark; 04-07-2015 at 02:19 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Central North Carolina
    Posts
    2,369
    Do NOT try to put a lacquer (paint, varnish, ...) finish on ANYTHING at this point ANYWHERE in the southern U.S. -- unless you have a sealed indoor filtered environment.

    Wait until fall when all the leaves are off the trees and stuff has stopped blowing around.

    Honestly, right now I'd be reluctant to put finish on anything in my garage shop even with my filters running.

    Of course, you can try to make your own one-time spray booth. If you do, try not to breathe while you're in it.
    Gary Merrill
    Wessex EEb Bass tuba (DW 3XL or 2XL)
    Mack Brass Compensating Euph (DE N106, Euph J, J9 euph)
    Amati Oval Euph (DE 104, Euph J, J6 euph)
    1924 Buescher 3-valve Eb tuba (with std US receiver), Kelly 25
    Schiller American Heritage 7B clone bass trombone (DE LB K/K10/112/14 Lexan, Brass Ark MV50R)
    1947 Olds "Standard" trombone (Olds #3)

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