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Thread: Changing my embouchure?

  1. #1

    Changing my embouchure?

    I'm posting this in the MP thread for lack of a better idea on where to put it - mods, if you feel like it belongs somewhere else, please let me know if I can move it.


    aloha all!

    I'm new to the forum, and I might as well be a new brass player too - I haven't played in more than ten years. Prior to that, I've played for about 15 years in small school bands.

    I'm primarily a euphonium player, but I play trombone and tuba by necessity as well.

    My learnings and skills are relatively limited when it comes to brass specialization. My small schools only had limited student level instruments, and only basic music teaching.

    After seeing all the information that is available on the internet - I've been wondering if I've been playing wrong this whole time. Here's how I cam to this conclusion:

    I haven't played euphonium in 10 years. My baritone horn wasn't in great shape, so I found an old used Conn on craigslist. I've played on a 6 1/2AL MP for as long as I can remember, so I used it with the Conn. It sounded OK, but all these forums and internet videos got me thinking I need a bigger MP. I switched to a 51D, and it feels bigger.

    My range used to top out at high Bb, and I want to expand the range. However, the 51D immediately dropped my range to a high F and struggling with Gs.

    Then I got to thinking - maybe if I try some "trick embouchures" I can get some range back. Normally my lips are about 50/50 in the center, but when I started trying about 2/3 upper lip, and 1/3 lower lip, if I blew softer, I could get a notes higher with less effort.

    Does that mean I've been playing incorrectly in the past, and I need to try learning to play with the new "trick embouchure"?

    Thanks for your assistance all. Without anyone around here to teach me, you're all I got. Thanks!

  2. #2
    Having an open mind about such things is a good start.
    There's nothing about 60/40 that would be described as a "trick embouchure." The fact is, 50/50 doesn't work well for very many players. 70/30 or 80/20 is more common, and some players need the reverse.
    Without seeing you I wouldn't make specific recommendations, but it's a good idea to experiment and see what works for you - not automatically do what somebody else does, or you think "should" work. Every face is different.

  3. #3
    Thanks Doug. It sure would be nice to get some help with my embouchure. I'll keep tinkering at it.

    Do you think the switch to the larger mp is a catalyst that may help? Or should I go back to the old familiar mp and try making the embouchure change on that instead?

  4. Naturally, when using a larger mouthpiece, you're gonna take a hit in your range, it's just gonna happen. The way to go isn't adjusting your embouchure, but just to practice, practice, practice. I had the same frustrations switching from a Bach 6&1/2 to a King 4G, but I was able to get back my range with a couple weeks of range exercises.

    As for embouchure...

    Your embouchure is kind of a very individualized aspect of your playing, and an 'ideal' embouchure will vary from player to player. However, I wouldn't recommend changing an embouchure you're already accustomed to in order to achieve range. I play with about 2/3 upper lip, myself, but I see more often that people will tend to use more bottom lip.


    I have a friend who's a performance major, who played with your described "trick embouchure," using more upper-lip his whole time in high school, but his private lessons teacher at the university forced him to undergo an embouchure change back to dead center 50/50.

    I'm not big on 'dead center' being the best embouchure for everyone, though. There are plenty of professionals and virtuosos who don't set their MP dead center, but many educators argue if you get used to using that 50/50 placement before you put in many many years of practice, you should because it will make things easier.

    Hope this helps!
    -SPY

  5. #5
    Most of the players who come to me to fix their embouchure problems are here because some well-meaning and highly regarded teacher along the way, who had no actual knowledge of embouchures, gave them very bad advice.

  6. #6
    Hey Doug. Just an update: I've been playing on the 51d and the high placement embouchure you recommended.

    I initially lost all my high range, but now I'm able to play some high Bb pretty consistently. Even more interesting - I'm able to eek out all the way to high D now. I've never ever been able to do that before. I'm working almost every day on my high range and will hopefully be able to play some of the songs I really like that are in that register.

    I can also play some pedal tones with the same embouchure now, and working on getting them to sound more clear.

    I can safely say its attributable to your advice. thanks again.

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