Need a New Mouthpiece not digging the one I have right now

[abbott456]

So I got a like new but used Kanstul Euph and the only large shank piece I own that works for beans on my Euph is a KW4AL which is a Kanstul Wick 4AL knock off. The mouthpiece has a nice rim and cup but the shank has something funky going on in there. I just cant slot very well with that piece in comparison to any other mouthpiece ive used before.

Im looking to get a "special" mouthpiece aka something fancier then a Wick 4AL which is dont get me wrong a great piece but im looking for something with a weee bit more mass to the piece. I dont really mind a larger rim but the cup depth and mass of the piece make a far larger difference to me. I have tried a few "massier" pieces such as the SM3U (wich I used to play on for a couple of months) and a DC3 (I think thats the model). The thing I dont like about the SM3U is that it has too much mass to it which seems to kill my high range much like trying to use a 1 1/2g megatone as a Euph piece but the "core" it added to my tone was very nice. The DC3 piece was very nice it had some mass to it but didnt way a ton and it sounded very good, it was a sweet sounding piece.

So ill prolly end getting a DC3 piece and a Wick 4AL as a back up. But are there any other pieces I should check out?

[BillHrnjak]

I recently swithched from a Wick 4AL to a Wick SM4U and I was very pleasantly suprpised by an increase in range (high & low) and an overall improvement in the quality of the sound. I am old (retired) amatuer and I double on bass trombone and use a Wick 0AL (slightly bigger then a Bach 1 1/2G) for that. Maybe the jump to the SM3U is just that tiny bit too much. Try the SM4U before you go looking for something special. My euphonium is a York 3068.

[ghmerrill]

Bill:

Have you tried the Wick 0AL in your euphonium? If so, can you describe the results?

[BillHrnjak]

Gary



No, I have never used the 0AL in the euphonium. It is too late this evening to try your experiment tonight. I normally play only bass trombone on weekends because I can use a mute and not disturb any of the neighbors. You have peaked my interest and I will try the 0AL and let you know the results. There should be no real learning curve involved or time needed to adjust as I play both mouthpieces every week and can switch back and forth as I please.



Bill

[ghmerrill]

Thanks. I await any results.

(This whole neighbor thing is a bit foreign to me since we can barely see our neighbors -- has been that way for over 25 years -- and they are not remotely upset by the sounds of medium to large caliber weapons going off at various times of day and night, plus nearby rock blasting, and the occassions on which you can hear the artillery practicing at Ft. Bragg 30 miles away. So tooting a brass instrument isn't even on their radar ).

[BillHrnjak]

Gary,

My curiosty got the best of me and I went out and played the euphonium for about an hour this morning. I was surprised by the results - not what I would have predicted. The 0AL reduced the high range by about half an octave - the notes were still playable, but it took a lot more effort to produce them. The low range remained the same (I expected more power down there) but it was no improvement, in fact it souded very sluggish below low F. The middle range was the most obvious difference. The horn lost all of the really beautiful singing quality, the British sound that I really like. The 0AL made the horn sound very "woofy" and fat and in all honesty very "dead". Not darker or richer or teutonic as I have heard others describe horns but really non-euphonium like and not at all pleasant and not a sound I would be happy to continue producing.

I have long believed that every horn I own and play has a particular mouthpiece that makes it perform at its highest level and allows the horn to produce the sound that I want to hear from that instrument. I have proven that idea to myself many times with many instrument/mouthpiece combinations. The SM4U is my best match for the 3068 and the 0AL is my best match for my Conn 73H. Once I find the mechanical match that fits the sound I have in my head, it is my job to make the parts perform as a team and that is all me and no longer the equipment. I guess you could say it is the musician and not the horn at that point.

Bill

[ghmerrill]

Bill,

Thanks. This is very valuable and on its basis I will cross the 0AL off my list of things to try with the euph. The 1AL also does not look so good to me (backbore), but I think the 2AL may be worth trying. I'm looking for a kind of optimal "tenor tuba" mouthpiece. The 3AL would be sufficient, but I want to see if the 2AL might give me a richer low (even contra) range.

I agree with what you say about matching the mouthpiece to the horn (and player, of course). I absolutely LOVED my Schilke 60 for bass trombone and had the highest hopes for it on the euphonium, but it was a complete bust. I had never liked the Wick mouthpieces for trombone or tuba, but they seem fantastic for the euphoniums.

[abbott456]

Well I thought I would update the status on my mouthpiece search. I ended up getting a Wick 4AL for my Kanstul it was the most efficient and I guess "British" sounding of the pieces I tried out that match the sound in my head. I also tried out the Wick 3AL which was a great piece and it gave off a warmer more I think American sound then the 4AL. I also tried a SM3, SM4, SM3U and SM4U which are great moutpieces which normally I would pick over something like the 3AL but on this particular horn they just didnt seem to have the same efficiency or presense as the 4AL or 3AL I tried. So... yay! lol

[euphool]

Try an Alliance DC2& get rid of all the other mpc you have. PS I think you have the Kanstul I once owned.. George S. age 92 (awaiting Carnegie debut) HIRSBRUNNER black, COURTOIS 267 Best of luck.

[abbott456]

Who did you sell the horn through? I purchased the horn from Noah Gladstone.

Also im 99% sure the bell is Comercial Bronze the color is far closer to the color of my mostly all Bronze Kanstul 970 Tenor Trombone and is not at all close the rose brass color of any Gentzen, Edwards, Kanstul or Holton Trombone ive ever seen. The Bronze bell is ok... I love the sound but I feel that its less responsive/resonant then a Yellow Brass Bell which may or may not be a good thing