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Really Cleaning Your Horn

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  • davewerden
    Administrator
    • Nov 2005
    • 11137

    Really Cleaning Your Horn

    Now and then you have to get serious about cleaning out your euphonium or tuba. It's not easy, because there are a lot of tubes and, in the case of compensating horns, a lot of corners and bends that are hard to get to. Here is my process. Note that I am describing the process for piston valve horns. You may want to adjust some of the steps if you have rotary valves.

    The first step is to power-flush as much as you can out of the horn. You need a warm day for this. Take your horn outside where the garden hose is. Then dump a bunch of dishwashing soap down the bell. Wrap enough cloth around the end of the hose to make a seal about a foot down into the bell. When you have crammed the hose into the bell, turn the water on. The idea is to force the water through under pressure until it comes out the leadpipe (it should shoot out pretty well if you seal the bell-end correctly). As soon as the water comes out the other end, press down all the valves so the water/soap is forced through their tubes as well. This will stop the flow out of the leadpipe for a second. As soon as it flows out again, remove the hose. You want to leave as much soapy water in the horn as you can. If you let the water run too long the soap flushes out. Then lay the horn down and let the soap soak in a bit.

    Then you want two plastic buckets or tubs, one filled with soapy water and one with clean water. After the horn has soaked for 15-30 minutes, put the hose back in the bell and rinse it out, remembering to press the valves to get the water through all the tubes. When you are convinced it is clear of soap, turn off the water and start to take the horn apart. Put all the metal parts into the bucket of soapy water. If there are any foam rubber bumpers inside the valves, put them in a cup to keep track of them. Also put any felt washers into the cup. For your valve pistons, unscrew the top button and remove it. There is probably a felt washer inside, which goes into the cup. Then take off the top cap. Under it there should be a felt washer, foam washer, cork bumper, or some other bumper. Remove it and place it in the cup. For horns that use a silicone bumper, that can go in the soapy water.

    I have a couple of cleaning snakes that I use next. I take out each valve slide from the water and run the snake through it. After that I use the hose to force a stream of high pressure water through the tube. Then put the part in the pail of clean water. As much as possible, do this will all the parts. You should also run the end of the snake through each valve port. Be careful as you rinse those out because the water may follow a curve and come right back at you!

    Once all this is done, I dump out the soapy water and rinse that bucket. The shake out each part and place it in the dry bucket. Then I take it all inside and prepare to reassemble the horn.

    If the inner tuning slide tubes (that part that is hidden when you insert the slide into the horn) do not look smooth and shiny, you should use a little mild metal polish like Simichrome on them. Use slide grease (I prefer synthetic) and put all the slides in. Replace the bottom valve caps, but first put the slightest amount of grease on the threads so they don't freeze later. Insert the springs and oil and replace the valves. If the surface of the valves looks dirty or rough, try a little of the mild metal polish there as well. You should also make sure the top and bottom edges of the valve pistons are clean. Sometimes they can become grimy or corroded. Gently scrape off any residue that is there using a plastic scraper or even a wooden craft stick.

    If your felt washers/bumpers have become compressed, try to find replacements. If you can not conveniently, then wash them as well. But do not squeeze them to dry them. Just set them on a paper towel for a day until they are dry. Otherwise you may cause them to compress and lose some of their softness.
    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
    YouTube: dwerden
    Facebook: davewerden
    Twitter: davewerden
    Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium
  • RickF
    Moderator
    • Jan 2006
    • 3871

    #2
    Really Cleaning Your Horn

    Excellent write-up Dave for cleaning out one's horn. I've never tried using the hose wrapped with a rag or towel to force water through. Makes sense.

    I have found some good brushes and snakes that can be used wet or dry called, 'Brass Savers' by the same company that makes the pad savers for wood wind instruments - "HW Products".


    I have the baritone, trumpet and trombone set. They're safe to use in that there are no exposed metal ends or wire. The snakes have this curly-cue design that exerts some pressure on the inside of the slides as you pull it through to help clean them. The brush has two ends (small and large ) for cleaning the ports of the valves and the valve casings. I use the brush dry sometimes for spot cleaning and then re-oiling.

    H.W. Products Inc.

    [Editor's Note: you can click these links to Amazon for either the Tuba Version or the Trombone version]

    Baritone/euphonium version here: Baritone/euphonium version

    These sets are around $15 to $17. They're available at Amazon.com and Dillons music.


    Last edited by RickF; 05-29-2023, 01:52 PM.
    Rick Floyd
    Miraphone 5050 - Warburton BJ / RF mpc

    "Always play with a good tone, never louder than lovely, never softer than supported." - author unknown.
    Symphonic Band of the Palm Beaches

    El Cumbanchero (Raphael Hernandez, arr. Naohiro Iwai)
    The Cowboys (John Williams, arr. James Curnow)
    Festive Overture (Dmitri Shostakovich)

    Comment

    • prototypedenNIS
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2006
      • 518

      #3
      Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

      I have access to an ultrasonic cleaner... very quick, very effective

      Comment

      • davewerden
        Administrator
        • Nov 2005
        • 11137

        #4
        Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

        Originally posted by: prototypedenNIS

        I have access to an ultrasonic cleaner... very quick, very effective
        denNIS: Can I assume this is a shop-sized machine (i.e. something large enough to hold your whole horn)? I'm guessing this is not something a hobbiest is likely to own(?).
        Dave Werden (ASCAP)
        Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
        Adams Artist (Adams E3)
        Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
        YouTube: dwerden
        Facebook: davewerden
        Twitter: davewerden
        Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

        Comment

        • SteveMcGovern
          Member
          • Mar 2006
          • 97

          #5
          Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

          There was a guy on the trombone.org forum who attacked the horn from the other direction. He soldered a garden hose connector to a mouthpiece shank, so the full force of the water pressure could go in through the leadpipe.

          Comment

          • davewerden
            Administrator
            • Nov 2005
            • 11137

            #6
            Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

            Originally posted by: SteveMcGovern

            There was a guy on the trombone.org forum who attacked the horn from the other direction. He soldered a garden hose connector to a mouthpiece shank, so the full force of the water pressure could go in through the leadpipe.
            I'm sure that would work. The reason I like going the other way is that it causes an increase in pressure as the water goes through the horn (because the diameter is getting smaller). I thought it might flush it better, but I haven't tested it both ways.
            Dave Werden (ASCAP)
            Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
            Adams Artist (Adams E3)
            Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
            YouTube: dwerden
            Facebook: davewerden
            Twitter: davewerden
            Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

            Comment

            • peternotar
              Junior Member
              • Apr 2006
              • 1

              #7
              Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

              I have used the bathtub for my euphonium and baritone. I usually used dishwashing detergent and let the horn soak until the hot water turned cold. This would be rather difficult for a tuba/sousaphone unless you used your local hot-tub.
              Of course the untrasonic cleaner would be great. Must be awfully large to accomodate a lower brass instrument!

              Comment

              • davewerden
                Administrator
                • Nov 2005
                • 11137

                #8
                Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                Originally posted by: peternotar

                I have used the bathtub for my euphonium and baritone.
                The bathtub is a good idea, but cleaning the horn there can leave a pretty greasy ring around the tub, which is why I chose the other method. However, it might be more convenient to use the bathtub. If you choose this way, I would still suggest doing the hose flush first. It will help to clean out some of the small inner curves that you might not be able to get to even after the horn is disassembled.

                Dave Werden (ASCAP)
                Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
                Adams Artist (Adams E3)
                Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
                YouTube: dwerden
                Facebook: davewerden
                Twitter: davewerden
                Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

                Comment

                • prototypedenNIS
                  Senior Member
                  • Feb 2006
                  • 518

                  #9
                  Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                  for $60 I think it's pretty reasonable to visit a decent repair shop. Plus we might be able to spot some problems you may not have noticed. A solder in time, save large dent work...

                  your idea does seem to be very good as an alternative to getting your horn professionally cleaned though.

                  MIght I suggest a way to dry off the horn well and quickly... air comporessor with a spray nozzle.


                  I agree with the force into the bell aside from the leadpipe, this should be done when using an air compressor as well, but if you'd like to see why going through the leadpipe doesn't work, give it a try.

                  Comment

                  • keithbarton
                    Senior Member
                    • Mar 2006
                    • 242

                    #10
                    Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                    I use the "hot tub" method except that I pour a cup of Simple Green in the hot water. Doesn't hurt the horn's silver finish and REALLY cleans out the horn. And the Simple Green helps remove the greasy ring around the tub. If it doesn't, my wife cleans the tub out for me, after she quits hollering at me.

                    Comment

                    • davewerden
                      Administrator
                      • Nov 2005
                      • 11137

                      #11
                      Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                      A small note about the hot water soak. Be careful if your horn is lacquered (especially if it is an older instrument). I accidentally soaked off the lacquer on an old Besson once. It was a very long time ago before the modern epoxy lacquers, so maybe it's not as much a concern these days. Anyone know?
                      Dave Werden (ASCAP)
                      Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
                      Adams Artist (Adams E3)
                      Alliance Mouthpiece DC3, Wick 4AL, Wick 4ABL
                      YouTube: dwerden
                      Facebook: davewerden
                      Twitter: davewerden
                      Instagram: davewerdeneuphonium

                      Comment

                      • Smitty
                        Junior Member
                        • Jun 2006
                        • 20

                        #12
                        Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                        FWIW,

                        I've used a method similar to Dave's for cleaning out my horns. I prefer going the opposite way of air flow for the same reason you backflush an engine-- pushing the crud back out the way it came in keeps it from being forced into areas where it is harder to remove.

                        Regards,

                        Smitty

                        Comment

                        • Smitty
                          Junior Member
                          • Jun 2006
                          • 20

                          #13
                          Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                          I hadn't thought of using Simple Green for my horns. I have used it with good results on really grimy, crud-encrusted metal parts on my firearms, mechanics tools, and engine parts.

                          Smitty

                          Comment

                          • RickF
                            Moderator
                            • Jan 2006
                            • 3871

                            #14
                            Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                            I cleaned out my horn yesterday and decided to try Dave's method of 'back flushing' through the bell. It worked pretty well too! Instead of stuffing rags around the garden hose, I used a 6" piece of swimming noodle I had in the closet (I hope my grandkids don't notice it's 6" shorter )
                            Click image for larger version

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                            The noodle already has a hole in it for the hose fit through. What surprised me though was when I turned on the hose, a small lizard shot out through the lead-pipe and scampered away. For a second I said, "What the... ?". Then I realized the lizard was in the garden hose looking for a cool place to stay. I then took the horn inside and soaked it in the bath tub with warm soapy water using Dawn dish soap. Also used a snake and pipe cleaning brush to clean the inside of the valve casings, and slides.
                            Last edited by RickF; 08-19-2016, 09:16 AM.
                            Rick Floyd
                            Miraphone 5050 - Warburton BJ / RF mpc

                            "Always play with a good tone, never louder than lovely, never softer than supported." - author unknown.
                            Symphonic Band of the Palm Beaches

                            El Cumbanchero (Raphael Hernandez, arr. Naohiro Iwai)
                            The Cowboys (John Williams, arr. James Curnow)
                            Festive Overture (Dmitri Shostakovich)

                            Comment

                            • daruby
                              Moderator
                              • Apr 2006
                              • 2217

                              #15
                              Really Cleaning Out Your Horn

                              Geez Rick....First Lizards, then snakes...you are getting positively reptilian with that horn of yours! Next thing, you will be using alligators to clean out your euph!

                              Doiug
                              Adams E3 0.60 Sterling bell - Prototype top sprung valves
                              Concord Band
                              Winchendon Winds
                              Townsend Military Band

                              Comment

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