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Thread: Cheap but decent used horns

  1. Cheap but decent used horns

    Hi, I'm Karl and just registered with this forum.



    I wanted to ask about the expected price range for finding a used euphonium. You see, I'm thinking about starting up brass again, years after all my instruments were stolen (d'oh!). Which of the three (trumpet, 'French' horn, euphonium) I pick up depends on what prices I can find for reasonable quality.



    I don't need professional models or any special features, and compensating system is not needed though a fourth valve is preferred. Mainly I am looking for an affordable used instrument, beautiful or ugly, that plays well without serious ergonomic, intonation, or timbre problems.

    How much might I expect to pay for a relatively cheap used euph that is in acceptable condition?


  2. Cheap but decent used horns

    Of course you're going to find a decent trumpet for almost nothing on ebay and you can always switch to euphonium later. French horns tolerate dents less well in terms of sound degradation they're tough enough to play without a bunch of dents and, besides,you can get the same effect stuffing a plastic milk bottle into to the bell of your euphonium. 4 valve choice, Yamaha 321 from about 500 & up in miserable condition but playable.

    I think most of us have gravitated to the euphonium because we love it.

  3. #3
    Guest

    Cheap but decent used horns

    I'd say you should keep a vintage Conn 24i or 25i on your radar. You might be able to find an ugly but nice sounding one for $500 or so. Pretty ones will cost at least twice that much.

  4. Cheap but decent used horns

    A milk bottle in the euphonium bell. Interesting...

    If I were to do that, are there special euph mouthpieces that are good for hitting high notes, allowing me to play in the alto range for extended periods? The euphonium has the same fundamental pitch as the B-flat side of the double horn so harmonics and fingering would not be a problem.


  5. #5

    Cheap but decent used horns

    Originally posted by: judgeschreber I'd say you should keep a vintage Conn 24i or 25i on your radar. You might be able to find an ugly but nice sounding one for $500 or so. Pretty ones will cost at least twice that much.
    I just went through the "stock" of older horns at the University of Minnesota to see what maintenance is needed. There were several old Conns, and I was reminded as I tested them what nice horns they were in their day. The Constellations were the best, but even the plainer models were very nice. They probably had the best sound of the American-style euphoniums in that era (when Conns were Conns, Kings were Kings, etc.). So the advice above is good. If you can find one, you might be very happy with it.

    A number of these were made with "short-action" valves. The travel was only about 2/3 of a normal valve. This was done by flattening the tubing as it passed through the valve. The total area was the same, but the shape was an oval instead of round at that point. If you see a photo of the valves of a horn for sale, you can tell easily by looking at the lower ports (the top ports were generally round). The valves feel great and make it easier to play fast, but fingerings with 2 or 3 valves feel a bit stuffier than on the conventional horns. It's something you might want to keep in mind.

    Dave Werden (ASCAP)
    Euphonium Soloist, U.S. Coast Guard Band, retired
    Adams Artist (Adams E3)
    Alliance Mouthpiece (DC3)
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  6. #6

    Cheap but decent used horns

    I'm quite happy with my Weril 4-valvle that I picked up in brand new condition on eBay for $500. Haven't run into any intonation issues that I can't lip into place. The only problem is the valves make a bit of noise (not metal sounds - sloppy sort of popping sounds) but it isn't noticeable by anyone except the player.

    Peter.

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Cheap but decent used horns

    The popping sound you hear might be the pressure differences building up in the horn while the horn changes temperature... especially when playing slurred passages. This bothers me a times too... especially when I'm practicing in a small bedroom or practice room. As the horn warms up there are differences in pressure in the horn where the note is being produced and the valve (and slide) you're adding to the length of the horn. This difference in pressure can cause a popping noise.

    See this link for more discussion:

    Blowing Bubbles
    Rick Floyd
    Miraphone 5050 - Warburton BJ / RF mpc
    YEP-641S (recently sold)
    Doug Elliott - 102 rim; I-cup; I-9 shank


    "Always play with a good tone, never louder than lovely, never softer than supported." - author unknown.
    Symphonic Band of the Palm Beaches
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    Chorale and Shaker Dance
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  8. #8

    Cheap but decent used horns

    Thanks Rick
    The link you provided was quite interesting and sounds like it directly relates to what I'm hearing from my horn. I do tend to practise in our rather cool basement so it's quite plausible that there is some definite change in air pressures as I warm up (I've been told I'm full of hot air more than once!). I'll pay more attention next practise session to see if the noise lessens as I practise more.

    Peter.

  9. Cheap but decent used horns

    Keep your eyes open. And let your friends know what you want.

    3 valve bell front horns can be found for under $50 in working order.

    4 valve Conn, King, Holton or Martin would be great and can be found for under $500.

    For a cornet you might want to look for a King Master Model. Its older but plays like a dream (if you use a Bach 5V) for a euphonium player.


  10. Cheap but decent used horns

    Originally posted by: monty

    The only problem is the valves make a bit of noise (not metal sounds - sloppy sort of popping sounds) but it isn't noticeable by anyone except the player.



    Peter.


    I remember that some Tuba players at MSU had their rotary valves vented to eliminate the poping of the valves. They had a hole drilled in the valve case (by a professional) that vented the valve when the slide was out of the loop. The valve plugged the hole when the valve was depressed.

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