Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

[fsung]

I recently received a Sterling Symphonic Band euph on loan from Custom Music to use while mine is in the shop.

The Symphonic has a 11.5" bell (295 mm), as opposed to the 12.25" (310 mm) bell on my Virtuoso, and lacks the tuning trigger, heavy 4th valve cap, and goldplated highlights, and the leadpipe is soldered to the bell (it's off the bell with a center brace on my Virtuoso).

After a few initial hiccups getting a feel for the differences between the Virtuoso and the Symphonic, I have to say that the more I play the Symphonic, the more I want to keep it.

This horn sings. From behind the leadpipe, the sound seems more compact and slightly more focused. Overall, it's bit more work to play in the upper register than the Virtuoso and the intonation issues are more noticeable (but still very manageable), but the tone, especially starting around the F above the staff (BC) and on up, is simply gorgeous!

At this point, I'm seriously tempted to inquire about the price. (It would be perfect as a backup horn and for outdoor events like Tuba Christmas and the Salvation Army Red Kettle Band.) If I every have to replace my Virtuoso, I will probably get one with a 300mm bell, but if, for some reason, a Virtuoso is not available, I could be very happy with a Symphonic.

[davewerden]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

Life is full of tough choices

I'm still a little torn myself sometimes. I like the sound of the Virtuoso with the larger bell for some things, but I like mine for other things. And the sound of the Symphonic model really is lush. There are times I would like a bigger sound, but I'm also enjoying the greater clarity that comes with the slightly smaller bell.

I felt a little that way back when I played Besson and I tried the 968 compared to my 967. The 968 had a smaller bell and leadpipe and was a clearer sound in many circumstances. But that made me choose the different leadpipe if I wanted the smaller bell - with the Sterling I could still keep the larger leadpipe and have my choice of bells (not to mention the further choice of whether or not to have the leadpipe soldered to the bell).

Life was simpler back when there was only the Besson as a professional choice. But it wasn't as much fun, either!

[JTJ]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

Felix was kind enough to let me play the Sterling today, and I mentioned it as an aside in an earlier thread. It plays wonderfully well. I agree with Felix, was most impressed by the solidity, ease and power with which the high range above F above the staff plays. But it was first class from the lowest notes to the highest. In many respects it reminded me of a Willson with a simply beautiful British sound -- your using the word lush is a good description, Dave. Plus, it had a powerful high B with a lot of core and beauty to the sound. The only negative was the stiffness of the springs: the valves worked smoothly but took a lot of force to depress, which after a bit made my hand a little achy.

[daruby]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

While I was in the UK this month, I met up with Paul Rigget at the "factory". He had laid out five (yes!!) horns for me to try. These were (in order):

1. Virtuoso with 300mm yellow-brass bell
2. Virtuoso with 300mm red-brass bell
3. Virtuoso with 12" red-brass bell
4. Virtuoso with rimless bell
5. Yorkshire Rose custom bell

I was able to play each in an A/B comparison with my Besson 2051. My wife was the impartial listener and she could definitely hear the difference between the Sterlings and my Besson. My primary focus was on the first three horns which were just being prepped to be sent out to customers. The rimless and the Yorkshire Rose were horns that Paul uses at trade shows and displays.

The three "standard" Virtuosos all played wonderfully. All of them had a darker, more robust tone than my Besson which has a smaller, lighter bell than any of them. The sound and response of all of the horns was wonderful. I would have to say that the responiveness of all was similar to my Besson, which is to say that they were easy to play and centered notes easily across the range. (These modern horns are just great in that respect). And yes they all played high B wonderfully. Since these were brand new horns being prepped for shipment, Paul locks down the adjustable tuning trigger and does not oil the valves, so it was not possible for me to compare the mechanical elements of the horns.

Of the three, I liked the 300mm red-brass horn the best. The red-brass is somewhat heavier than yellow brass and produces a darker sound. The 300mm yellow-brass horn just didn't sound quite as nice as the red-brass horn to my ear. I found the 12" red-brass horn too large for me. It became difficult to control in the high range (like my old Sovereign) and just required too much strength. I might mention that all three horns had the same "high mount" bell brace as my Besson so were designed to produce a darker sound than the lower bell brace that some prefer. Paul showed me some horns in productioon for "down-under" that had the lower-mounted brace for a brighter sound. Note that Willson mounts this brace even higher still (nearer the bell mouth) to deaden the ringing of the bell even more.

The rimless horn was just too bright and punchy for me but blew with the same effortless response as the others.

The prize in the lot was the Yorkshire Rose. WHHAATTA HORN!!! I loved playing this horn. The bell is extremely heavy but not too large. The custom rim that forms the rose makes the bell very stiff. As a result, it was unusual to play since the bell just didn't vibrate much. You didn't get the same feedback through your body and chest when the horn is pressed up against you that you get with a normal bell. OTOH, it blew effortlessly and had a wonderful sound. I really like that horn, though I think I would want to play it in a proper hall with a professional listener before I would go out on a limb to buy it.

Summary: All of the Sterlings played wonderfully. They had the kind of responsiveness that I like in my new Besson but with a darker, richer tone. They didn't seem to have any "bad notes" and were easy to move around on. For me, the 300mm red-brass horn provided the best compromise between ease of play and sound. The Yorkshire Rose was my overall favorite however due to its rich sound and unique appearance. I cannot comment on mechanical aspects of the horns since these were new horns being prepped for shipment, but I suspect that my Besson is superior in this respect.

I want to thank Paul Rigget for his wonderful hospitality. He picked my wife and I up at the train station and spent nearly 2 hours with us on the day before his summer holiday shutdown. Thank-you, Paul!

Doug Ruby

[fsung]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

Thanks for the review, Doug. Now I REALLY want to try the Yorkshire rose! And if the 300mm red brass bell Virtuoso plays like the Symphonic, I definitely want one. Maybe I'll set mine down behind John's car and get him to back over it when I get it back so I can order one.

Dave, you're right about tough choices! I do like the huge sound I can get from my Virtuoso, however, most of the playing I do, at least at this point and for the forseeable future, is in small ensembles where the clarity and focus of the smaller bell would likely be preferable. Also, I've read several comments that the Besson 968 and 2058 don't require as much strength to play as the 967 and 2057, as well as Doug's observation about the 12" red brass Virtuoso requiring more strength and being more difficult to control in the high range than the 300mm version, which make me think that the 300mm version might be a better fit on down the road. (Of course, this is all nit-picking. For now, there ain't nothing wrong with my Virtuoso that some serious practice and a bit of exercise won't fix.)

[warumtobendieheiden]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

Hello Gents,

The pre-Virtuoso Sterling 1065S is what I happen to play; I acquired it through an outrageous stroke of good fortune about three years ago. I have avoided mentioning it on this website up to now, not wanting to sound self-congratulatory nor to risk being compared to the fine artists who otherwise play Sterling instruments . . .

My particular horn has the 29cm yellow-brass bell (thickness unknown), soldered-to-bell leadpipe and upper-position bell brace.

Since I have not had a chance to compare my horn to any other Sterlings, Virtuoso or otherwise, I'm not sure what I can add after the terrific posts above. I do find it interesting, however, that others have commented on the sound in terms that echo the way I'd describe it; focus, clarity, solidity, intensity of sound (yes, even when played by ME). Intonation-wise, I thought I'd died and gone to heaven after two years of playing a popular and respected non-comping japanese instrument. As far as build quality goes, I'd say that it's not as hyper-precise as the Willsons and Yams I have seen. Maybe the new Virtuosos are better in that regard.

Valves: I believe the valves on the older Sterlings like mine have a slightly shorter travel than some other instruments, maybe only by one-sixteenth inch, but noticeable. And I too find the springs a little too stiff; sooner or later, I will look into a lighter set (I sure would like some advice from you folks!).

Overall, I feel a little like I've won the lottery -- but humbled at the same time -- every time I get the horn out of its case. A few months ago I sat next to the principal euph player from the Army Ground Forces Band, who hand-picked his instrument at the factory in a certain European country known for its mountain landscapes. He blew my old Sterling for a while and said, "call me first if you want to sell it."

I guess the final message here is: whoever is horn-hunting and finds an available older Sterling would be well-advised to overlook the flaws and age-spots; just sit down, play it, and listen to the sound. It is not the only great euphonium sound in town, but it just might be the one that speaks to YOU.

William Bryan
"Warum toben die Heiden?"

[fsung]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

William, thanks for chiming in and congratulations on scooping up a great horn. And while there are indeed many fine artists who play Sterlings, I can personally attest to the fact that there is at least one hack amateur who does as well. (John and Dave could as well, but they're too much the gentleman to do so.)

Originally posted by: warumtobendieheiden

As far as build quality goes, I'd say that it's not as hyper-precise as the Willsons and Yams I have seen. Maybe the new Virtuosos are better in that regard.

Age and usage differences aside between my Virtuoso and the loaner Symphonic, I would say that the fit and finish of my Virtuoso are markedly better than that of the Symphonic. (That's not to say that the fit and finish of the Symphonic are bad, but that the fit and finish of the Virtuoso is very close, if not equal, to that of the Willson and Yamaha.)

Valves: I believe the valves on the older Sterlings like mine have a slightly shorter travel than some other instruments, maybe only by one-sixteenth inch, but noticeable. And I too find the springs a little too stiff; sooner or later, I will look into a lighter set (I sure would like some advice from you folks!).

I think the travel is slightly shorter than on the Virtuoso, but it's longer than the travel on a Besson New Standard.

I like stiff springs (in fact, I used to use F tuba springs in my New Standard, and had Custom send me the heaviest set of euph springs available for my Virtuoso), so I think they're great.

Any decent metalworking shop should be able to make springs to fit (in fact, they could probably duplicate your springs using a lighter gauge or wire), though it'll probably be just as cheap, if not cheaper, to buy a set of Yamaha springs.

If you like lighter springs, you might want to look into getting a set of conical (tapered) springs. Unlike regular (cylindrical) compression springs, the force rate of conical springs increases as they are compressed, so conical spring will uncompress faster than a regular spring of the same length, pitch, and wire diameter, meaning that your valve pistons will return more quickly. (Alternatively, you could go with an even lighter conical spring and get the performance of a heavier cylindrical spring.)

Conical springs are also less likely to buzz because they're more stable laterally than regular springs, so they're less prone to buckling and coming into contact with the valve casing, and the coils seat inside one another as the spring bottoms out instead of compressing against one another. The only thing to watch out for is that the ends of the spring are ground square so it'll sit flat; otherwise all bets are off.

I guess the final message here is: whoever is horn-hunting and finds an available older Sterling would be well-advised to overlook the flaws and age-spots; just sit down, play it, and listen to the sound. It is not the only great euphonium sound in town, but it just might speak to YOU.

I could not agree more. I would scoop up one of these for a backup horn in a heartbeat if the opportunity presented itself.

[davewerden]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

I prefer a heavier spring, and have for all my professional life. Maybe the heavier Sterling springs are partly my fault - I don't recall if Paul had a preference for light/heavy. Anyway, it takes a while to get used to the heavier action, but there is an advantage. I think they return more quickly, so you get a cleaner sound during technical passages.

[ydave]

Pre-Virtuoso Sterling

I preffer lighter springs
So Paul sent me a shortened version of his springs, but at the time the valves were still seating in so they got a little slugish.
I went back to the heavier (original springs) and never looked back:
a) I got used to them (I agree with Dave they are more positive)
and b) the valves are slick now, although I do have to wipe and oil them
(Hetmans light, imported from the US!) at least twice a week due to I
presume very fine tolorances, in the bad old days I never used oil but I did
wash my round stamp every Sunday Morning!!!! So its a bit of a shock to
the system.

Cheers
Dave

[Lario]

Sorry I never saw or heard of the Sterling Symphonic euphonium. Is it simply a pre-virtuoso?