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Thread: Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

  1. Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    Hi y'all...

    Listening to the conversations of Arnie Williams and Terry Woodard got me to thinking about a new Prestige. I really want to hear more feedback from both of you after you have been playing your horns for a few weeks and/or months. However, I also wanted to get a better sense of the difference between the 2051 (11.25" bell) and the 2052 (12.25" bell).

    I am currently playing a 1980 vintage Boosey & Hawkes Sovereign (model 967 serial #660597) that I think is closer to the 2052 in specification. Because of a heart attack 7 years ago, I am somwhat challenged in terms of heart and lung capacity compared with when I was younger. I love the sound of my Sovereign, but sometimes it is a lot of work and literally tires me out. Also, taming the intonation on the 6th partial of this horn is challenging.

    My question, is the 2051 enough smaller that it would be a bit easier to play than a 2052? What is the difference in sound? I play the Denis Wick 4AL so that may also be a factor.

    Doug
    Adams E3 0.60 Sterling bell - Prototype top sprung valves
    Concord Band
    Winchendon Winds
    Townsend Military Band

  2. Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    This is a very good question, which I'm sure will get some varied responses.

    Back several years ago when I was first working with Dillon Music to buy my first compensating horn, I had a lot of questions regarding this very thing. The Willson euphoniums come in two bell sizes, as do the Bessons, as do, I believe, the Sterlings. Players swear by each depending on how their experience and passion runs. Some say that the larger bell euphoniums sail very near a tuba sound and that the smaller bell euphoniums sould more like, well, euphoniums. There may be some truth to that, but I also think it has a lot to do with personal preference.

    Your question about the amount of air it would take to propel these is also good. Is it just shank size that affects the amount of air needed or does bell size also enter into it? Very good question.

    The Yamaha 642S and 842S are interesting in that I believe their bell radius is the same but the 842S is apparently a lighter-constructed bell and therefore not as loud as the 642S but some say more of a tonal singer because of that.

    For me and for now, I'm loving the 2051 more each time I play it. But your question intrigues me and I hope we have some input from our experienced colleagues out there in euphonium land.

    Best of luch to you in your investigation and ultimate decision.

  3. Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    Arnie,

    I know that the Willson 2900 is a medium shank horn while the 2950 is a large shank horn. I have heard that the 2900 has a smoother, perhaps just a little lighter sound while the 2950 is darker (and rumored to have more intonation issues). I played a Besson Imperial (predates the Sovereign) for many years. It was medium shank and 11" bell. It played similarly to the Sovereign (967) but was a little easier to blow. I guess I was wondering if the 2051 and 2052 exhibit a similar difference. Though I guess since they are bot large shank horns, there won't be much difference, eh?

    Doug
    Adams E3 0.60 Sterling bell - Prototype top sprung valves
    Concord Band
    Winchendon Winds
    Townsend Military Band

  4. #4

    Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    When I spoke with Demondrae Thurmond about the differences between the horns, he strongly preferred the 2051. He certainly sounds awesome on it. And Steve Mead plays the 2052. I had a Besson 967 for a little while but never have spent that much time with the 968 except at conferences. In doing a brief comparison I thought the 968 had an ever so slightly smaller sound, but it was much easier to steer. Intonation also seemed easier to correct on the smaller horn. In comparing the 967 to a B&H Imperial, the 967 had a much richer sound, but I still found the Imperial much easier to play. And after playing on the Imperial for awhile, I adapted to it. If I ever decided to go for a Prestige, I think I'd be inclined to go for the 2051.
    - Scott

    Euphoniums: Dillon 967, Monzani MZEP-1150S, Dillon 1067 (kid’s horn)
    Bass Trombones: Greenhoe GB5-3G, Getzen 1052FDR, JP232
    King Jiggs P-bone

  5. #5

    Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    I just heard from Davin Vance at Dillon Music. My 2052-2 has arrived and will be shipped out tomorrow. It should arrive sometime next week. I'll let you know how it plays after it arrives. I'm not a professional player, but since I've tested the 2051 at NABBA I'll give you my impressions after I've played my new horn. I can't wait!!!

    Terry

  6. Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    I'm especially interested in hearing what you think, given that the horn you tested at NABBA was a 2051. I've played mine now for several weeks and I'm loving it more each time. I attended my first rehearsal with Austin Symphonic Band last week, and mine was the third Besson. One fellow had a fairly new Sovereign and the principal had an older Besson that was incredibly beautiful looking and sounding. It had a dull brushed silver finish (the first I've seen). None of the ASB euphoniumists had seen a Prestige before, so all were curious about the tuning slide trigger mechanism. The other members were playing Yamaha 642s.

    Anyhow, the 2052's sound will no doubt be different than what you tested at the conference, so I'm eager to hear what you have to report.

    I hope you arranged to pick up your horn at the UPS office rather than playing Russian roulette with home delivery.

    Good luck with the 2052.

  7. #7

    Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    Arnie,
    How long did it take for your horn to arrive? I know you had a fit trying to be home to receive it. We chose to have it delivered to my home since I'm able to be here. I was supposed to get a tracking number, but will have to call Monday to get it from Davin. It was to be shipped Friday, so I'm thinking maybe Wednesday?

    I'll let you all know when it gets here and I try it out!

    Terry

  8. Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    Terry:

    It only took a couple of days to go from NJ to Texas. Then 4 days after its arrival, I actually took possession of it. It arrived on a Friday, but I missed being home by five minutes. UPS doesn't do a second delivery on the same day and they don't deliver on weekends, so I ended up arranging to pick it up on Monday night at their depot.

    So, depending on when they shipped, you might have it by now. Hope so.

  9. #9

    Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    I received my 2052 this week. I thought I would give you my impressions so far, but keep in mind however that I am not a professional musician. I am extremely pleased with the intonation and sound. Having played the 2051 at NABBA, the 2052 does take a bit more air to play, but it seems to project a bigger, more well rounded sound than the 2051. The upper range responds easier on the 2051 and its sounds a little more mellow. The 2052 has a fuller sound particularly in the middle range down.

    That said, there was not a tremendous difference in quality of sound. Both horns are easy to play and the valves are really fast. There was a little squeakiness in the 4th valve, which I think will stop after I play it for a while and the little silicon bumper on the back of the trigger came off - the glue holding it didn't work well, but that can be fixed easily. All in all I was really impressed by the workmanship and quality of this horn. After hearing what Arnie says about his horn and my impressions of the horns I played I think all the new Bessons must be very consistent.

    I checked it with my tuner and it was right on the money and I found only a couple of notes where I needed to use the trigger in the 6th partial. I played it with the SM-3 and can just pop out pedal tones - they are great.

    I have not played it with a large group yet. I have rehearsal next week and I'll see how it sounds in a large band. But I know this will be a great solo horn. Pieces that I have had to work hard to play, are now much easier.

    I am not familiar with a lot of different brands of horns like many of you are on this board, but I have no doubt that I have a really great horn. Everybody who has heard it so far (including some professional musicians) have been really impressed. I'm enjoying it so far. Wish I'd had this horn years ago.

    Terry Woodard
    Retired Euphonium Player

  10. Prestige 2051 vs. 2052

    Glad to hear your 2052 arrived safely and that you're enjoying getting acquainted with it.

    An update on my 2051 might be in order. One: the squeeky 4th valve didn't get less squeeky over time. So you might encounter the same thing. Also, it seems to get dirterier than the others, but that may be normal.

    I LOVE the way the horn handles condensation. I mostly only have to empty the tuning slide spit valve occasionally, but the other two don't seem to hold much condensation, so the horn plays pretty long without having to be flushed.

    In terms of "tuning", I haven't checked it against a tuner, but I look forward to doing that later this month when I start up private study with Dr. Rodriguez over at Texas State. More on that later.

    Let me know how you do on the high range. Sounds like the 2052 favors mid to low. I'm working on sustained A natural, A Flat, and B flat at the octave above the staff (bass clef), but that's more of a personal embouchure kind of thing (and mouthpiece) than horn thing, except in the case of the 2052, which might be more of a challenge in the upper range. Let me know how it goes.

    I think you'll continue to love the horn. Good luck with it.


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